Robot kills man.

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Robot kills man.

Postby bigglesworth » Fri Mar 28, 2008 5:40 pm UTC

http://www.goldcoast.com.au/article/2008/03/19/9039_gold-coast-top-story.html

So, a man programs a robot to kill him, sot it's not by accident. That's something new.
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Re: Robot kills man.

Postby segmentation fault » Fri Mar 28, 2008 5:47 pm UTC

i wonder if the robot feels guilty.
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Re: Robot kills man.

Postby Robin S » Fri Mar 28, 2008 5:59 pm UTC

Bit of a misleading title. My guess is that he set up the device to kill him because it was psychologically easier to activate it rather than pull the trigger himself, or possibly (this seems less likely) because he wanted to go out in style.
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Re: Robot kills man.

Postby Lumpy » Fri Mar 28, 2008 6:11 pm UTC

According to the tabloid Inquirer, the activation button was labeled the "Screw you, Asimov" button, but that may have been a joke on their part.

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Re: Robot kills man.

Postby alexgmcm » Fri Mar 28, 2008 7:14 pm UTC

Lumpy wrote:According to the tabloid Inquirer, the activation button was labeled the "Screw you, Asimov" button, but that may have been a joke on their part.

Lol, Asimov sprung to my mind when I read the title.

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Re: Robot kills man.

Postby LilPixie » Fri Mar 28, 2008 11:26 pm UTC

Wow... that's sad in many levels.
I know this may not sit well with people, but man what a coward! R.i.p.

The robot, however, will most likely become junk, have its parts sold and so on.
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Re: Robot kills man.

Postby VentcoreFrog » Sat Mar 29, 2008 1:21 am UTC

I think I heard about this in government class the other day.

That's pretty depressing. Though, it is interesting, in a morbid sort of way, that he would actually make a device that would kill him.
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Re: Robot kills man.

Postby Robin S » Sat Mar 29, 2008 1:26 am UTC

I'd say it's fairly interesting, in a morbid way, just to buy a ready-made weapon (or ammunition, or poison, or whatever) with the intent of using it to kill yourself, or even to write a suicide note. I suppose building a robot designed to fire the gun is just extending the process of preparation.
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Re: Robot kills man.

Postby VentcoreFrog » Sat Mar 29, 2008 1:55 am UTC

Well, it's just that you never really see anyone go as far as to build a robot for suicide.
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Re: Robot kills man.

Postby LilPixie » Sat Mar 29, 2008 2:00 am UTC

...Maybe he was trying to start a business but didn't think through enough? I don't know, suicide is a.. I don't want to go into it.
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Re: Robot kills man.

Postby Memo » Sat Mar 29, 2008 2:26 am UTC

I can see two reasons for it.

First, if you're going to shoot yourself make sure you actually die. Normally, you're able to shoot yourself only once and one shot can easily leave you with brain damage and paralytic but alive. What better way to make sure to die and stay dead than building a machine that will shot at least 4 times into your face?

Second, his relatives wanted to send him into care. What does he do? He builds a freaking machine that is able to shoot a gun multiple times. It looks to me as the ultimate 'fuck you' to his relatives for someone who knows his life will keep sucking if he keeps going on.

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Re: Robot kills man.

Postby bigglesworth » Sat Mar 29, 2008 10:03 am UTC

It's a bit like the device that turns itself off, if you think about it.
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Re: Robot kills man.

Postby fjafjan » Sat Mar 29, 2008 12:23 pm UTC

suicide booth here I come!
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Re: Robot kills man.

Postby hyperion » Sat Mar 29, 2008 12:27 pm UTC

This story is useless without pics of the machine
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Re: Robot kills man.

Postby Robin S » Sat Mar 29, 2008 12:34 pm UTC

Memo wrote:What better way to make sure to die and stay dead than building a machine that will shot at least 4 times into your face?
One way which springs instantly to mind is to build a machine which will shoot at least several hundred times, not just at your face but the entire area that your body occupies.
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Re: Robot kills man.

Postby Freakish » Sun Mar 30, 2008 12:05 am UTC

LilPixie wrote:Wow... that's sad in many levels.
I know this may not sit well with people, but man what a coward! R.i.p.

The robot, however, will most likely become junk, have its parts sold and so on.


His life was pretty much over. Once you've been put into a home you just slowly waste away.
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Re: Robot kills man.

Postby benjhuey » Sun Mar 30, 2008 10:08 pm UTC

The title is a little misleading. The man purposefully sits in front of the machine, so it's not like an intentional act (or even accidental) on the robots part.

I sure there's more than one way to remotely fire a weapon, so this just doesn't seem all that interesting to me. For all I'm concerned, this is similar to simply hanging one's self with a large string of thousands of paper clips; it's different but not all that original.
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Re: Robot kills man.

Postby Blubb3r3ng3l » Mon Mar 31, 2008 12:46 am UTC

LilPixie wrote:Wow... that's sad in many levels.
I know this may not sit well with people, but man what a coward! R.i.p.

The robot, however, will most likely become junk, have its parts sold and so on.


how in the hell is this cowardly? He's 81, being asked by a lot of people to be moved into care, a position that most with a functioning brain will recognize as taxing on children and taxing on other people, has clearly put a lot of thought into this, as he did it in his driveway where he knew he could be seen..

I know he killed himself, but if this isn't a time to do it, after a long and probably fruitful life (though he wasn't terminal with anything), then I don't know if there ever is.

As you can see, I'm a bit of a fan of the whole 'dying with dignity' thing when it may actually be warranted...
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Re: Robot kills man.

Postby Herman » Mon Mar 31, 2008 3:51 am UTC

Yeah, this guy sounds... pretty cool. At 81, with failing health, he builds a suicide robot, and he's confident enough in his skill, and determined enough, to use it. This is the act of a smart, incredibly stubborn, and maybe slightly crazy, man. Intellectually, I have doubts about whether suicide is ever morally okay, but viscerally, I wish there was an afterlife so I could meet him.

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Re: Robot kills man.

Postby Lumpy » Mon Mar 31, 2008 3:54 am UTC

It'd be awesomely if while working on his robot, he had been inspired to create a mechanism to easily reproduce this in phone booth for and sell it on the open market. The first episode of Futurama says the suicide booth is invented in 2008! We must fulfill the prophecy!

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Re: Robot kills man.

Postby MikeBabaguh » Mon Mar 31, 2008 7:54 am UTC

LilPixie wrote:Wow... that's sad in many levels.
I know this may not sit well with people, but man what a coward! R.i.p.

The robot, however, will most likely become junk, have its parts sold and so on.


Are you kidding? That man died by his own hand (sort of), deciding the one single thing that remains a mystery until it happens: how we're going to die.
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Re: Robot kills man.

Postby Felstaff » Mon Mar 31, 2008 8:24 am UTC

hyperion wrote:This story is useless without pics of the machine


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Re: Robot kills man.

Postby Maurog » Mon Mar 31, 2008 11:51 am UTC

This is a funny spin on the story.

But seriously, that wasn't a robot, it was just a machine.
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Re: Robot kills man.

Postby Endless Mike » Mon Mar 31, 2008 2:35 pm UTC

Oh this is brilliant. Let's TEACH the robots to shoot people. THAT'S a great way to prevent their uprising. Maybe next someone will make a human slavery robot.

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Re: Robot kills man.

Postby Felstaff » Mon Mar 31, 2008 3:23 pm UTC

Endless Mike wrote:Maybe next someone will make a human slavery robot.


It's called a personal computer.
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Re: Robot kills man.

Postby Aluminus » Mon Mar 31, 2008 3:50 pm UTC

Wait. You're saying he built this robot for the express purpose of killing him? That's kind of unusual. Normally, a killer robot is supposed to turn on you, so you can gasp out "No... no... I created you!!" with your last breath.
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Re: Robot kills man.

Postby LilPixie » Mon Mar 31, 2008 5:07 pm UTC

Dignity?
Well, all i can say to that is, give me an operational definition of dignity, because i clearly do not hold the same definition as you do.
Yes, he is 81. Yes his family wants to put him away. Yes, he is probably scared.
But to decide to build a machine (because i agree that this is a machine and not a robot) to shoot you four time in the face in order to make "your last statement" is ridiculous, IMO. Why, if he had a "fruitful" life would he have done that?
If he stopped to consider the possibility of his family caring for him enough to want him to live in a place where he would be taken care of, maybe he wouldn't need to go through the hassle of building the machine and leaving his family broken hearted. Yes, asylums are not good, and i'm not advocating for them, but for most families that have an elder living with them, it gets increasingly harder to be able to give the kind of help that an older person needs. And if there is an elder you love and care for living alone, there is always a switch on in your brain, constantly reminding you that something could happen that you may not be able to remediate, and for some people this is devastating.
I don't agree with suicide. I don't think it is at all honorable; much the contrary. I believe in the "human network", that we are linked to people regardless of our want, and I think that if you don't have the sense to look around and ask for help when you need it, then you shouldn't simply decide end it all and break these links up so violently, because you haven't thought it through enough. To me the practice of suicide is very immature. Growing old does not imply growing up, nor growing wise; I don't care that he was 81 or not, to me it is still cowardly, regardless of any situation. (Unless you're terminally ill and the treatment is torturous and pointless; in that situation i can agree with suicide.)
What a waste of resource and time! He could have sat there and devised ANYTHING, but he was selfish enough to care only about his world, his "pains" (that were workable), without maybe giving himself a pet in the back and pushing forward for a new phase.

IMO
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Re: Robot kills man.

Postby Cooley » Tue Apr 01, 2008 1:34 am UTC

I was really worried before I read the article: what if the robot had gotten out of it's cage? Was it programmed to stop, or to go on a human hunt, where it's always hunting season?

But then it only had 4 bullets, and it foolishly used them all on one guy who wanted to die.

I'm glad it all worked out, and that the robot will be killed without a trial.

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Re: Robot kills man.

Postby Princess Marzipan » Tue Apr 01, 2008 1:49 am UTC

The above post earns my seal of approval.

Pixie: This guy clearly preferred death on his own terms to life at those of others'. I can understand your reasoning and see why you might not make the same the choice, but I see this as a case where the choice was his to make. I don't know enough information to actively agree or disagree on principle, but I do respect his decision either way.
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Re: Robot kills man.

Postby LilPixie » Tue Apr 01, 2008 2:22 am UTC

Nougatrocity wrote:Pixie: This guy clearly preferred death on his own terms to life at those of others'. I can understand your reasoning and see why you might not make the same the choice, but I see this as a case where the choice was his to make. I don't know enough information to actively agree or disagree on principle, but I do respect his decision either way.
In that case, sit with your family and explain your reasoning. I, however, don't agree either way. Plentiful research on the life an elder can/may live in a nursing home are available and the simplest modification on cognitive perceptions might change forever the way an elder sees a nursing home. The reason a nursing home idea does not sit well with most people is that we have made early cognitive commitments to what aging is (hell, essentially). What is proven, however, is that there are a lot of exceptions, and the exception proves the rule (arguing against the former commitment). Look at the case of the Birdman of Alcatraz: he was sentenced to a life in prison and the one single occurrence of taking care of a wounded sparrow sparked a whole new cognitive commitment of purpose in "a life in prison", and he was later sought out as an expert because he brought a whole new meaning to his time in prison (and not just any prison, mind you).

I **know** this doesn't sit well with people, specially in the USA careless definition and commitment of freedom, but to "prefer death" over something that could be easily fixed is too easy; it's almost like committing to war because you can't sit down and find a long term goal that, if worked on together, would likely bring out similarities and avoid the need for loss of life and money.

Like i said in another thread, knowledge and wisdom are two very different concepts/things; to know you can end your life (and acting on it) is very different from pondering in the ramifications such act provokes. And i know this from experience: it's too violent, stupid, and selfish (i am not saying this for pity, so save it.) The ramifications (the end) do not in any sense justifies the act of suicide (means). It frustrates me that someone would be so ego-centered that s/he would waste her/his experience and intelligence (because he wasn't an ignorant person - this frustrates me even more) in something so narrow minded and insignificant (yes, to kill oneself, imo, is insignificant - you undermine a life of accomplishments, emotions, experience out of fear (thus lending itself cowardly).)
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Re: Robot kills man.

Postby 4=5 » Tue Apr 01, 2008 2:29 am UTC

if he had the attitude he did then he wouldn't have been able to do any good in a nursing home, so he did something awesome outside of it.

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Re: Robot kills man.

Postby LilPixie » Tue Apr 01, 2008 2:53 am UTC

4=5 wrote:if he had the attitude he did then he wouldn't have been able to do any good in a nursing home, so he did something awesome outside of it.
Maybe to himself he did, but i find it peculiar that "suiciders" completely disregard others when in life what justifies/explains/perpetuate a sense of being is actually SOCIETY (and this is particularly understood if one is inclined to read up on traditional Hindu societies). This frustrates me to no end! I believe that what comes to the mind of a person who is willing to take her/his own life is that everyone has suddenly vanished, it's as if people had never been there; that in itself disintegrates the narrative of a lifetime: it would be the equivalent of not remembering anything, not even language, culture, ethics... nothing. We learn all that based on culturally-influenced, people-reinforced behaviors and yet here comes someone who has her/his nose so deep within her/his own shit they completely miss the first condition for understanding the meaning of "being" to the extent of... <very loud grunt>

Still - does - not - make - sense.
Still - think - it - is - cowardly.
Still - think - it's - stupid - and - wasteful.
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Re: Robot kills man.

Postby lorenith » Tue Apr 01, 2008 3:24 am UTC

Honestly, I think his relatives probably didn't care all that much, considering he didn't WANT to move into a home, and they were demanding he go into it, if he was able to build a machine that could do this he must've been doing well enough on his owns without his relatives pressuring him about stuff.


what comes to the mind of a person who is willing to take her/his own life is that everyone has suddenly vanished, it's as if people had never been there; that in itself disintegrates the narrative of a lifetime


In my experience that's a pretty good reason for someone to want to disappear, if no ones really there in the first place why hang around?

Also, don't ever talk to someone who's suicidal, you're the sort that would only make matters worse rather than better.

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Re: Robot kills man.

Postby LilPixie » Tue Apr 01, 2008 4:22 am UTC

lorenith wrote:Also, don't ever talk to someone who's suicidal, you're the sort that would only make matters worse rather than better.
Hm, contrary to that, the last time i got a call from someone who was willing to "end it all" (and this was the second of only two occasions in which this happened), i was quite able to clarify my point of view in the matter and help this person to get appropriate help and get out of the pit her/his mind trapped her/him in. In the first occasion, however, i didn't know what to say and did not have a set opinion on the matter (one could say i was riding that fence big time), and... i prefer having a clear, set point of view in this subject than being indecisive, and i feel strongly about it because, well, i have taken time to consider this and have taken time to do some research.
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Re: Robot kills man.

Postby lorenith » Tue Apr 01, 2008 4:29 am UTC

Coulda fooled me to be honest, I know you wouldn't have been all that helpful to me when I was going through some icky times the way you react to things, woulda been happier to lock myself back in my room then have more insults thrown at me about how I felt.

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Re: Robot kills man.

Postby LilPixie » Tue Apr 01, 2008 4:56 am UTC

lorenith wrote:Coulda fooled me to be honest, I know you wouldn't have been all that helpful to me when I was going through some icky times the way you react to things, woulda been happier to lock myself back in my room then have more insults thrown at me about how I felt.

I'm sorry, I was responding to the question of how i found the act of suicide a cowardly act, not trying to help someone who's going through an "existential crisis." I'm sorry if i insulted you, i was just explaining my reasoning, not drawing up a line and telling people that if not on my side, they're wrong (hence the many instances in which "IMO" was used).

And fooling you? This is a forum. On the internet. I don't know you, your opinion is welcomed but, honestly, if you think poorly of me it makes no difference whatsoever. You're not a participant part of my life other than someone to converse with on [at times] difficult/silly/comic/serious subjects. Why, in the name of science, would i want to fool you? That makes no sense.
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Re: Robot kills man.

Postby 4=5 » Tue Apr 01, 2008 7:27 am UTC

"coulda fooled me" is an expression. it is a polite way of saying that the speaker's perception of your actions don't match up to your perceptions.

I agree with you that sometimes it isn't the time for suicide, but I think no hope for a better future is a quite valid reason for it.

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Re: Robot kills man.

Postby bigglesworth » Tue Apr 01, 2008 4:27 pm UTC

Also just now LilPixie wasn't talking to a person considering suicide. He was writing messages of an open internet forum. I'm imagining that they didn't use exactly those words.
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Re: Robot kills man.

Postby LilPixie » Tue Apr 01, 2008 6:12 pm UTC

4=5 wrote:"coulda fooled me" is an expression. it is a polite way of saying that the speaker's perception of your actions don't match up to your perceptions.

Aha, interesting. And I'm not being sarcastic; English is my third language and nuances are often not computed until a person stops/takes the time to explain them to me (off topic: my Logic professor was talking about that just yesterday, what a coincidence...)

4=5 wrote:I agree with you that sometimes it isn't the time for suicide, but I think no hope for a better future is a quite valid reason for it.

Hm... in this case, the case of the 81 year old, maybe I should then clarify: I think efforts should be put in motion to counter the idea that aging = suffering/hell/dependency/learned helplessness.
It's appalling to me that with so much research in the field, serious research done by serious scientists, this misconception prevails. I wish there was a way in which to counter the flow/understanding that after a certain age we are put in the corner and are allowed to rot.
This man needn't die; if he was this efficient, diligent, and determined, he could have helped a lot of people, not only old people in the nursing home where he might have found a niche teaching some electronics, but also in being an exception to the aging idea we have, strengthening what psychologists have been almost screaming at the top of their lungs. The reason I was so fervent/passionate in condemning his action as cowardice is that I really feel bad for his situation, and I would hope we, educated people, were doing more about it. To me, it's a very sad loss, and I wish to him peace if there is an afterlife. I also wish his family will recover and be able to move on without the possible feeling of guilt and trauma (PDSD).

bigglesworth wrote:Also just now LilPixie wasn't talking to a person considering suicide. SHe was writing messages of an open internet forum. I'm imagining that they didn't use exactly those words.

I'm a gurl 8)
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Re: Robot kills man.

Postby lorenith » Tue Apr 01, 2008 6:26 pm UTC

The main point is, he didn't want to go to the home and his family was pressuring, probably bordering on forcing him to go to one. He seemed capable enough to live on his own if he built a machine, why the hell should his family decide what he does with his life?

Old folks Homes really suck, all the ones I've visited for various reasons, have me convinced that I'd rather live on my own when I'm that old, especially if I'm already perfectly capable of functioning on my own, why the hell should anyone be coerced by their family to live somewhere they don't want to, nor need to go?


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