Trump presidency

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby freezeblade » Mon Nov 19, 2018 7:51 pm UTC

And then, as per usual, his supporters will take his uneducated and uninformed opinion as a 100% accurate reading of the subject and repeat it as a valid part of political discourse. Any facts that erode this highly simplistic view will be touted as fake news. etc.
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Re: Trump presidency

Postby Opus_723 » Tue Nov 20, 2018 2:54 am UTC

sardia wrote:
CorruptUser wrote:Ok, serious question. What activities would a forestry service normally do that could actually prevent fires?

Context: Trump talking out of his ass regarding what California should've done to prevent forest fires. At this point I'm half expecting him to say that it's Silicon Valley's fault for not having created a zombie-cyborg Smokey the Bear in time.

More cutting, more burning. Maybe put up a fight/permit to prevent sprawl into forest zones. Also most fires are started by humans, so maybe some enforcement/campaigning to reduce that. Forestry budgets are pretty tight, they really should increase those, cuz of the unending fires.


Not disagreeing with this at all, but it's worth pointing out how the politics plays out locally (I'm not from California, but Eastern Washington and Oregon have similar issues with fires, just not as bad).

The research shows that thinning underbrush and small diameter (less than one foot) trees can help with the fires. Local Republicans always spin this to claim that we need to open up more forest, including old growth, to logging. But the research shows that, at least in some types of forest, logging the BIG trees can actually make fires worse. Big old growth often survives the fires without burning, and keeps the forest floor shaded and damp. The majority of the fuel burnt in our fires is actually dry grass and shrubs. Whether removing bigger trees is helpful or not probably depends a lot on the specific type of forest, and without a lot of specific local research it probably shouldn't be done with the intent to reduce the impact of fires. Undergrowth and small trees is far less ambiguous, and seems to help pretty universally.

Even clear cuts, surprisingly, have an ambiguous effect, because most clear cuts aren't fresh, but rather several years old. Old enough that they are mostly dry grass and lots of small, spindly trees, with little shade from the sun compared to natural forest.

But cutting small spindly trees and undergrowth doesn't make anybody any money, so to do it on a large scale would take more public money, and it never happens. I think Colorado has a pilot program where they sell the wood for chips or something, but it's heavily subsidized and it's just one patch of forest.

And anyway, good luck trying to tell people that cutting down big trees might not help forest fires. It... doesn't usually go over well.

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby CorruptUser » Tue Nov 20, 2018 3:02 am UTC

Just a thought, maybe California should build denser instead of up? Easier to protect 100 sq miles of city than 500 sq miles of suburbs. It's not like California is known for earthqua... oh, right.

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby Pfhorrest » Tue Nov 20, 2018 3:29 am UTC

With the exception of the current Camp fire, which as I understand it just blew in to Paradise faster than first responders could get in its way, most of what burns out here in California is just the wilderness, because where there's houses there's roads and where there's roads you can easily defend against a fire, provided you get there before the fire has already blown across the road.

As a lot of you probably already know I live smack dab in the middle of the Thomas Fire burn area: my hometown is the only unburned thing within the perimeter. But that's because Ojai Valley is the only settled area within the perimeter: the rest is wilderness. I live on one edge of that valley, and the fire was initially across the valley, and because of that I had literally almost no fear for the sake of my own home, because there's the entire town between me and the fire and they were already holding the line on that edge of town, so there's just no way it was going to burn across town to me. I only got scared when the fire (still mostly in the wilderness) went on and on and on and on for ages and changing winds blew it way back off into the back country and then clear around the whole valley and then back at the valley from the side that my house was on, and then only until they established a defensive line on that side of the valley too.

If anything, building denser seems like it would be more dangerous, because then you'd have more people and structures closer to the edge of the settlement. If you've got a huge sprawl, only the people around the edges are generally in danger (modulo flukes like the Camp Fire), and the people far in the middle of the sprawl, or on the other side of it from the fire, are generally safe.
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Re: Trump presidency

Postby CorruptUser » Tue Nov 20, 2018 3:40 am UTC

Even if tomorrow we, all of humanity, were to not use a single drop more of oil or nugget of coal, climate change would still continue to get worse for a bit longer due to the time scales involved. So then, should we continue to settle California? Maybe we should consider moving industries such as Hollywood and Silicon Valley to other states?

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby ijuin » Tue Nov 20, 2018 5:27 am UTC

CorruptUser wrote: So then, should we continue to settle California? Maybe we should consider moving industries such as Hollywood and Silicon Valley to other states?


Sounds great. Let's revisit it when we've found the funding to relocate several million of the nation's wealthiest people and their businesses and the infrastructure to support them.

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby Zamfir » Tue Nov 20, 2018 6:14 am UTC

when we've found the funding

several million of the nation's wealthiest people and their businesses


Now that was fast

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby CorruptUser » Tue Nov 20, 2018 6:15 am UTC

IT is the most mobile industry there is. Companies like Uber dont need anything beyond office space and computers to program on. Even super computers are relatively mobile, and while the HVAC of a server farm isnt simple it still makes more sense to have a huge server farm in Maine and save a ton on the AC.

The movie industry is more difficult, but not much more. Just need office space and large warehouses for set building, something that's already in place in, say, Detroit.
The one advantage that Cali has is the wide variety of terrain nearby, but that's becoming more of a moot point what with all movies being CGI and filming being done overseas anyway.


Realistically, no, relocating 40m would be a nightmare. I'm just thinking out loud that we shouldnt expand in such a dangerous area unless the reward was enough.

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby ObsessoMom » Tue Nov 20, 2018 6:30 am UTC

The Los Angeles Times wrote:“It's not time for finger-pointing,” Zinke said. “We know the problem. It’s been years of neglect, and in many cases it’s been these radical environmentalists that want nature to take its course.…You know what? This is on them.”


Translation: "It's not time for finger-pointing. Unless you're pointing at radical environmentalists. Or anywhere other than at me, the guy who's currently in charge of the 40%+ of California that's owned by the federal government."

California fires: Trump administration now blames devastation on 'radical environmentalists'

Three more snippets:

Spoiler:
U.S. Interior Secretary Ryan Zinke blamed the state’s fires on “radical environmentalists” who he said have prevented forest management.

His comments come days after he and President Trump toured the devastation from Paradise to Malibu, with both vowing to help California recover from the disaster.

In an interview with Breitbart News, Zinke said he agrees with Trump’s comments about the fires being a result of poor forest management, and repeatedly said radical environmentalists were responsible for the destruction caused by the fires.


Experts agree that overgrown forests in California pose a heightened wildfire threat in some parts of the Sierra Nevada. But although Paradise is near forestland, the wind-whipped Camp fire tore across areas that burned in lightning fires in 2008 and were later logged. It was not fueled by heavy timber.

“It started out as a vegetation fire. When it reached the incorporated area, which is definitely a lot more urban and developed of an area,” Jonathan Pangburn, a fire behavior analyst for the California Department of Forestry and Fire Protection, said in an interview last week, “it turned into a building-to-building fire ... no longer carrying through most of the vegetation, especially in the upper canopies in the trees. It was not a crown fire through the Paradise area.”

The Woolsey fire, which burned suburban areas from Oak Park to Malibu, was not near any forests. It destroyed 1,500 structures and left three people dead.


The president also cited Finland as an example of a country with good forest management, saying it focuses “on raking and cleaning. They don’t have any problem.”

Experts were quick to note that Finland fires are much different from California fires.

A heat wave this summer caused huge forest fires across Europe, including Finland. Fires scorched forested areas in Lapland, a remote northern province near Finland’s border with Russia, forcing evacuations of summer cottages.

One big difference: Rainfall since May at Jarbo Gap in Butte County, near where the Camp fire started, was at 0.7 inches. The May-November rainfall in Rovaniemi, Lapland’s capital: 15.76 inches.

Finland and California also differ greatly in their winds, said meteorologist Geoff Fox in Irvine. California’s Santa Ana winds are dry, desiccating vegetation as they whip through canyons and passes. They don’t exist in Finland’s relatively flat country, Fox said.

Zinke said in his interview Sunday that Trump was right.

“You look at Finland. I had an opportunity to live in Germany. Their forests are healthy. They don’t have catastrophic burns because they manage the forest,” he said.


TL;DR:

1. With the exception of the Paradise fire, this month's major wildfires in California did not involve forests, so most of Zinke's talk about "forest management" is just trying to find excuses to justify selling big trees to loggers.

2. No amount of "raking and cleaning" will turn California into Finland, no matter what Trump thinks.

3. Finland gets a LOT more rain than California does, but even Arctic Circle countries are experiencing drought conditions and forest fires. Climate change is a thing.

4. Also, the populated areas of Finland are a lot flatter than California, which has lots of steep, wind-channeling canyons and mountain passes.

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby CorruptUser » Tue Nov 20, 2018 6:55 am UTC

Plus, its Finland. The Finns have +25 resistance to all elements and +2 constitution. To them, forest fires are just natural occurring saunas. The only thing that can harm them is alcohol poisoning and lake trolls.

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby sardia » Tue Nov 20, 2018 7:33 am UTC

The solution is the same as hurricane and flood insurance. You slowly push people out as you refuse to insure homes that are in danger zones. In short, they're doomed.

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source= ... o2&ampcf=1
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Re: Trump presidency

Postby ObsessoMom » Tue Nov 20, 2018 9:04 am UTC

sardia wrote:The solution is the same as hurricane and flood insurance. You slowly push people out as you refuse to insure homes that are in danger zones. In short, they're doomed.


Here's a map showing the "very high fire risk" areas of San Diego, which is the eighth largest city (population-wise) in the United States:

Image

(I live at the upper left corner of the "15" shield, if you're wondering.)

Notice that the "very high fire risk" area is not just around the edges. IT'S PRACTICALLY THE WHOLE CITY, due to the canyons. Which we couldn't fill in, even if we wanted to, because that's where the water needs to go when we get monsoonal rains.

The few blank/white areas aren't necessarily fire-safe. They're just not "very high fire risk." (Maybe they're only "high fire risk." I don't know. Wouldn't surprise me, though.)

Basically, the whole place is a tinder box.

We're doomed. And we haven't even discussed the earthquake danger, or the killer bees, or the Hepatitis A and meningitis outbreaks, or the defunct nuclear reactor whose spent fuel rods are being stored within the tsunami zone less than an hour up the coast.

But we've already been pushing people out for a long time, by making our housing supply so ridiculously unaffordable, and almost impossible to find at any price.

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby CorruptUser » Tue Nov 20, 2018 1:18 pm UTC

Flood insurance doesn't push people pit. Quite the opposite. It's guaranteed issue and backed by the federal government, resulting in the disaster of properties being built and rebuilt in high risk areas.

As for the nuclear reactor, luckily Brett Kavanaugh is there to help save the day, trying to force the Yucca Mountain open fir all your nuclear waste needs. Hooray?

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby sardia » Tue Nov 20, 2018 3:00 pm UTC

CorruptUser wrote:Flood insurance doesn't push people pit. Quite the opposite. It's guaranteed issue and backed by the federal government, resulting in the disaster of properties being built and rebuilt in high risk areas.

As for the nuclear reactor, luckily Brett Kavanaugh is there to help save the day, trying to force the Yucca Mountain open fir all your nuclear waste needs. Hooray?

The big fight, which rich proflood zone people are winning, is whether or not to refuse insurance of homes in flood zones. FEMA is trying to stop backing those policies (which stops the losses to insurances, which means no homes will be built in those areas. However, they are getting caving to political pressure.
Tldr if you refuse to insure homes that get destroyed every year, nobody will build or live there. Therefore less wasted insurance money and casualties. If you do insure homes in flood zones, then you get the opposite.

They key point is that the government does have powerful levers to stop people from building homes in flood zones. Without government support, nobody could afford flood insurance in danger zones.

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby Soupspoon » Tue Nov 20, 2018 4:20 pm UTC

Insurance (state-assured cover) only for homes that are at least ?twice? as old as the last flood event that struck? Covers complete rebuilds on existing foundations after that flood event (if there was 'continuous occupancy', apart from mandatory relocation of the owners during the rebuild - non-transferable by any ownership-brokerage scheme, but allow straight inheritance if the worst came to the worse during/after the event) to support those struck by events they cannot have known anything about, but discourages new-builds by having to ensure proven robustness (raised pilings, raised ground level upon the plot) before being first eligible for anti-disaster insurance. If you can build a house to survive a once-a-decade flood (fire, quake, hurricane, etc) and get two decades down the line without another 'normal' ten-yearly disaster wiping you out then you've earned protection against the once-a-century disaster that you couldn't plan for.

Does not apply to anything not reasonably experienced (you aren't automatically excluded from what cover you can find against on ecosystem-killing meteorite events for a further 66 million years, at an extreme, and just because your home on a small rise on the flood-plain hasn't experienced a boundary-topping flood since before modern-day settlement happened doesn't mean it's not coverable.

Probably the idea needs fiddling with against actuarial knowledge. Currently the base capitalist limit is that an insurer will charge more against more likely risks. If the government effectively acts as insurer-of-last-resort they can take advantage of that to reduce their own risks as much as they are allowed (government top-ups to the effectively peppercorn premiums from the home-owner, or mandated cover at fixed fee that's essentially a tax upon their wish to provide services to everyone they're not compelled to cover). This way, established people can still get the benefit but the pressure upon those not willing to or able to throw good money of their own at resisting and/or insuring against inevitabilities and who don't have a valid vested interest do not benefit from the blank-cheque(/check) in taking the initially cheap but ultimately risky option.


There's still niggles in this design (which may or may not reflect where we're starting from with the initial system, I'm not familiar with its exemptions/exclusions, and may be misunderstanding some of its actual operations) and obviously it could need a further overhaul to deal with things I'm not aware of. And I'm not sure that everyone would support even the (IMO) incontrovertibly sensible aspects.


Needless to say, for those places that are covered there must be sufficent payout (and support system) to not just remake the same vulnerable structure on the old spot. Perhaps factor in incremental improvements per event to sufficiently mitigate such an event, or cash-in-hand equivalent 'buy-back' (like written off cars, where still not deemed economic to repair for the suggested budget of maybe as-was price plus 25% towards inbuilt hardening) to go towards the relocation or other sources of funding to do the (certifiable) job themselves.

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby freezeblade » Tue Nov 20, 2018 6:58 pm UTC

Back around to Trump news, in a move that surprised nobody, Trump sides With Saudis Despite Khashoggi Killing (https://www.nytimes.com/2018/11/20/worl ... hoggi.html).
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Re: Trump presidency

Postby The Great Hippo » Tue Nov 20, 2018 8:14 pm UTC

freezeblade wrote:Back around to Trump news, in a move that surprised nobody, Trump sides With Saudis Despite Khashoggi Killing (https://www.nytimes.com/2018/11/20/worl ... hoggi.html).
The response contrasting this to his response to the Central Park Five sums it up well.

Well, at least we're all very sure that Trump would never, ever, ever kill a reporter. No, he would never do that. He would -- well... Hmm... weeeeee~ll...

https://youtu.be/35EWlJMmO4sah

Nah.

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby Angua » Tue Nov 20, 2018 9:45 pm UTC

Crabtree's bludgeon: “no set of mutually inconsistent observations can exist for which some human intellect cannot conceive a coherent explanation, however complicated”
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Re: Trump presidency

Postby Dauric » Tue Nov 20, 2018 9:49 pm UTC

We're in the traffic-chopper over the XKCD boards where there's been a thread-derailment. A Liquified Godwin spill has evacuated threads in a fourty-post radius of the accident, Lolcats and TVTropes have broken free of their containers. It is believed that the Point has perished.

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby Angua » Tue Nov 20, 2018 9:53 pm UTC

It's good we didn't get the emotionally unstable woman president.
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Re: Trump presidency

Postby The Great Hippo » Tue Nov 20, 2018 9:55 pm UTC

Members of the Press keep talking about not showing up to Presidential briefings, but I think they ought to do the opposite. I think they should all show up, and proceed to politely break the rules until they're all kicked out.

What would have really given me the warm and fuzzies from that press briefing with Acosta is if the reporter who came next had, rather than defending him, simply repeated his question. Then the next one. Then the next one. Then the next one.

Just keep repeating the question until they answer you or boot you out. It's the only responsible way to interact with someone so belligerently childish.

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby Thesh » Tue Nov 20, 2018 10:01 pm UTC

I would say each reporter should ask questions that just happen to follow up the previous reporter's question whenever they are evasive.
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Re: Trump presidency

Postby The Great Hippo » Tue Nov 20, 2018 10:49 pm UTC

That, too -- particularly with Huckabee. Just keep following up with the previous reporter's question when they keep acting evasive.

One difference between someone like Trump and someone like Putin is that Trump has no idea how to keep his cool when you confront him on his bullshit. He acts like a child having a tantrum. More people need to see him having a tantrum in response to adults talking to him politely but insistently.

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby Angua » Tue Nov 20, 2018 10:50 pm UTC

I'd be extremely impressive if they ever got to that level of cooperation.
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Re: Trump presidency

Postby Soupspoon » Tue Nov 20, 2018 11:36 pm UTC

It's the MM… of course they're in collusion, and are constantly receiving radio signals bounced down off of gay-frog chemtrails from Soros's Nazi Socialist Islamic Illuminati HQ, somewhere under the South Pole, just beyond the ice wall that surrounds the flat Earth's edge.

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby Pfhorrest » Wed Nov 21, 2018 1:21 am UTC

Wait I thought President Palin and Lizard Hitler lived under the South Pole. Are they in on it with Soros!?!?

(Also, I don't know where you learned your geography or your geometry, but the Earth can't be flat, because flat things can't be hollow, there needs to be some kind of volume in order for the lizard people to have a place to live. The flat earth theory is just what the lizard people WANT you to think, so you don't catch on to them.Wake up sheeple!)
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Re: Trump presidency

Postby addams » Wed Nov 21, 2018 4:22 am UTC

The Great Hippo wrote:Members of the Press keep talking about not showing up to Presidential briefings, but I think they ought to do the opposite. I think they should all show up, and proceed to politely break the rules until they're all kicked out.

What would have really given me the warm and fuzzies from that press briefing with Acosta is if the reporter who came next had, rather than defending him, simply repeated his question. Then the next one. Then the next one. Then the next one.

Just keep repeating the question until they answer you or boot you out. It's the only responsible way to interact with someone so belligerently childish.
Yes.
It has been done and it was effective...

Uh-Oh...
I might be remembering one reporter deferring to another reporter.

Simply re-asking the question seems like such a simple answer.
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Re: Trump presidency

Postby Koa » Wed Nov 21, 2018 5:06 am UTC

The Great Hippo wrote:Members of the Press keep talking about not showing up to Presidential briefings, but I think they ought to do the opposite. I think they should all show up, and proceed to politely break the rules until they're all kicked out.

I think this is an awful idea given the circumstances of the propaganda machine. The spin would be tremendously effective.

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby The Great Hippo » Wed Nov 21, 2018 5:09 am UTC

Koa wrote:I think this is an awful idea given the circumstances of the propaganda machine. The spin would be tremendously effective.
Keep in mind, by "politely break the rules", I mean "keep doing their job even when it's against the rules".

It's their job to ask people in power difficult questions, and -- when those people provide evasive non-answers -- to continue asking those same questions. Keep doing that. Even if it's against the rules. Especially if it's against the rules.

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby ijuin » Wed Nov 21, 2018 5:11 am UTC

Yes, it would likely be used to justify Trump’s claim that journalists in general are conspiring against him.

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby The Great Hippo » Wed Nov 21, 2018 5:19 am UTC

ijuin wrote:Yes, it would likely be used to justify Trump’s claim that journalists in general are conspiring against him.
While this might be the case, the alternative is calling upon journalists to not do their job.

I recognize there are no good choices here, but if the only options available to journalists are "do your job, get kicked out of the White House, and play into the narrative that journalists are enemies of the people" versus "don't do your job and permit the narrative to go unchallenged", then I say pick the former.

I'm pretty sure most journalists would, too. At least I certainly hope they would.

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby Koa » Wed Nov 21, 2018 5:47 am UTC

Are they getting anything accomplished at these briefings? Is there a point to press briefings when there is no cooperation and blatant lies? I don't mind if they don't go if they deem it. I have to imagine journalism right now is like the gold rush, and these particular hills might be all but tapped out after the Acosta event.

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby addams » Wed Nov 21, 2018 5:55 am UTC

Yes.
You have a point Koa.
Yet, The Gods be willing OrangeMan will not always be there.
The Press Briefing will become informative, again.
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Re: Trump presidency

Postby The Great Hippo » Wed Nov 21, 2018 7:57 am UTC

Koa wrote:Are they getting anything accomplished at these briefings? Is there a point to press briefings when there is no cooperation and blatant lies? I don't mind if they don't go if they deem it. I have to imagine journalism right now is like the gold rush, and these particular hills might be all but tapped out after the Acosta event.
The persistence of press briefings provides at least the appearance that this administration has to answer to someone -- and that the people who are trying to hold them accountable aren't happy with the situation. If the Jim Acostas of the world decide to stop covering Trump, that doesn't mean we stop hearing from Trump; that just means all our information about what Trump is saying will now come to us through people sympathetic to Trump.

Try to imagine how our political landscape would look right now if all our coverage of Trump's briefings were filtered through the lens of FOX news. That's actually pretty terrifying. I mean -- they're already effectively his own PR firm. The only reason they can't just flat-out lie about the shit he says is because there are other people there with cameras. What do you think happens if those other cameras stop showing up?

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby SecondTalon » Wed Nov 21, 2018 2:04 pm UTC

CorruptUser wrote:The movie industry is more difficult, but not much more. Just need office space and large warehouses for set building, something that's already in place in, say, Detroit.
The one advantage that Cali has is the wide variety of terrain nearby, but that's becoming more of a moot point what with all movies being CGI and filming being done overseas anyway.

When was the last time anything was filmed in California anyway? Aside from low budget "We filmed it here because we live here" stuff?

All the films seem to be shot in Vancouver (aka Tokyo, NYC, San Francisco, Paris, London, Shanghai, Various alien cities, Chicago, Atlanta, Mexico City, Havana...the list goes on) or the State of Georgia these days.
heuristically_alone wrote:I want to write a DnD campaign and play it by myself and DM it myself.
heuristically_alone wrote:I have been informed that this is called writing a book.

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CorruptUser
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Re: Trump presidency

Postby CorruptUser » Wed Nov 21, 2018 7:37 pm UTC

SecondTalon wrote:
CorruptUser wrote:The movie industry is more difficult, but not much more. Just need office space and large warehouses for set building, something that's already in place in, say, Detroit.
The one advantage that Cali has is the wide variety of terrain nearby, but that's becoming more of a moot point what with all movies being CGI and filming being done overseas anyway.

When was the last time anything was filmed in California anyway? Aside from low budget "We filmed it here because we live here" stuff?

All the films seem to be shot in Vancouver (aka Tokyo, NYC, San Francisco, Paris, London, Shanghai, Various alien cities, Chicago, Atlanta, Mexico City, Havana...the list goes on) or the State of Georgia these days.


Here's a nice list. WARNING: TVTROPES

But anyway, there really is no need for Hollywood to be located in LA anymore other than everyone is already there. Push come to shove, the offices could be relocated anywhere in the world if need be, just need space and an infinite supply of people willing to work for slave wages in the back end of things, as well as a bit of an art scene. So Austin, TX would be perfect. Cheaper than LA, labor laws that third world countries sneer at, infinite space, plenty of artists, etc...

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LaserGuy
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Re: Trump presidency

Postby LaserGuy » Wed Nov 21, 2018 7:56 pm UTC

Not sure if this has come up and I've just missed it, but apparently Ivanka Trump is in a bit of trouble for using private email for government business. This situation sounds vaguely familiar to me, though I can't remember where it came up in the past :roll:

idonno
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Re: Trump presidency

Postby idonno » Wed Nov 21, 2018 9:04 pm UTC

LaserGuy wrote:Not sure if this has come up and I've just missed it, but apparently Ivanka Trump is in a bit of trouble for using private email for government business. This situation sounds vaguely familiar to me, though I can't remember where it came up in the past :roll:

The one way that this is different from Hillary is that I would actually believe that someone stupidly used their private email because it was simpler long before I will believe that someone was running their own personal email server in their house because it was simpler. That said, if it comes out that she sent any classified info through this email account, it is way worse. Hilary at least had the server under her control (even though it wasn't properly secured) whereas this would be deliberately handing control of that information to another entity.

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sardia
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Re: Trump presidency

Postby sardia » Wed Nov 21, 2018 10:34 pm UTC

Isn't the lesson of the email thing that everybody violates private email rules, and it's not a big deal? Oh and that the media owes Clinton a apology for harassing her about it more than anyone else. I don't think the answer is to harass (but be unable to prosecute) hypocritical Republicans.

That said, I hope they find something so ivanka fries for her crimes. Hit Trump where it hurts, his family and money.

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CorruptUser
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Re: Trump presidency

Postby CorruptUser » Thu Nov 22, 2018 12:13 am UTC

Trump gets hurt when his family is injured?! Maybe Ivanka, but that's because she makes him money.


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