The Darker Side of the News

Seen something interesting in the news or on the intertubes? Discuss it here.

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addams
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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby addams » Tue Apr 23, 2019 7:46 pm UTC

Zohar wrote:Unsurprisingly, this is a horrible shitshow and exactly what Republicans wanted - to disenfranchise votes and remove support from liberal states.
Crap...
Will this Orange ShitShow never end?
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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby sardia » Wed Apr 24, 2019 4:23 am UTC

Zohar wrote:Unsurprisingly, this is a horrible shitshow and exactly what Republicans wanted - to disenfranchise votes and remove support from liberal states.

It wasn't clear how much each of the conservative Justices were going to be partisan. Sometimes they're critical of conservatives, Most people weren't expecting a full on GOP circlejerk.

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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby svenman » Mon Apr 29, 2019 9:59 pm UTC

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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby KittenKaboodle » Tue Apr 30, 2019 12:49 am UTC



What indeed!
from article linked to:

"More than 270 election workers in Indonesia have died, mostly of fatigue-related illnesses caused by long hours of work "
"Some seven million people were helping count and monitor the 17 April vote. "
"Around 80% of the 193 million eligible voters cast their votes "

that must be one hell of a ballot if counting 22 of them could kill a person.
on the other hand, Wikipedia says the average life expectancy in Indonesia is 71 (in 2012); 7 million / (71*365*24) about 11,. So out of 7 million, one would kind of expect about 11 people per hour to be dying anyway.

Don Henly wrote:We got the bubble-headed-bleach-blond
Who comes on at five
She can tell you 'bout the plane crash with a gleam in her eye
It's interesting when people die


The "media" can be math challenged at times, while I don't remember the numbers now, but I do remember being bewildered by a news account of a plane crash that said plane fell from (high altitude) to (much lower altitude) in (a very small number of) seconds, I remember thinking WTF that's like Mach 3, what the heck is the terminal velocity of an airliner? and anyway the "high altitude" did not seem high enough for 1g acceleration to get to that kind of speed, not to mention that the "very small number of seconds" wouldn't have been enough even if falling in a vacuum. And I'm pretty sure ordinary turbofan engines are probably not providing much thrust at supersonic speeds.

This just in: Early reports indicate that dozens, perhaps hundred have died while I typed this post! (correlation does not equal causation)

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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby Thesh » Tue Apr 30, 2019 1:24 am UTC

Mountains can cause an aircraft's altitude to fall relatively quickly.
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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby ucim » Tue Apr 30, 2019 4:46 am UTC

Thesh wrote:Mountains can cause an aircraft's altitude to fall relatively quickly.
Well, AGL, but not MSL. (Yes, mountains can affect MSL but not that quickly).

Did you hear about the airliner that crashed into a smog bank? They had to use helicopters to get the people out.

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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby svenman » Wed May 01, 2019 11:35 am UTC

KittenKaboodle wrote:that must be one hell of a ballot if counting 22 of them could kill a person.

I'd wondered about that math, but the figures do work out to about one election worker per 22 voters, so that seems to be how you meant it. As for why so many election workers,
BBC News wrote:The elections were the first time the country of 260 million people combined the presidential vote with national and regional parliamentary ballots, in order to save money.

You quite rightly point out that among any group of people over a specific timespan you statistically have to expect a certain incidence of deaths:
KittenKaboodle wrote:on the other hand, Wikipedia says the average life expectancy in Indonesia is 71 (in 2012); 7 million / (71*365*24) about 11,. So out of 7 million, one would kind of expect about 11 people per hour to be dying anyway.

...which, assuming a 12-hour working shift, would work out to 132 deaths, already explaining half of the death toll if the vote helpers were constituting a representative sample from the population. However, I'd expect vote helpers to be strongly biased to healthy adults who should have a significantly lower death rate. Maybe my expectation is mistaken and those vote helpers had a large percentage of, for example, elderly people?

Another bit of background:
BBC News wrote:[...] temporary election staff [...] do not undergo a medical examination before starting work.

And still. If counting votes is an occupation with an in any way elevated death hazard - even if it is "only" twice the normal likelihood of death - something has gone very wrong. Admirably as it may be to give your life for democracy, that shouldn't be the kind of situation to demand it...
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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby Dauric » Wed May 01, 2019 2:19 pm UTC

svenman wrote:...which, assuming a 12-hour working shift, would work out to 132 deaths, already explaining half of the death toll if the vote helpers were constituting a representative sample from the population. However, I'd expect vote helpers to be strongly biased to healthy adults who should have a significantly lower death rate. Maybe my expectation is mistaken and those vote helpers had a large percentage of, for example, elderly people?


Actually you would expect vote talliers to skew towards elderly and/or retired. It's not a high-paying job and the regularity of employment is worse than seasonal jobs (at least working seasonal happens about a quarter to a third of the year every year, vote talliers would only be employed post election for a few weeks at most). Able-bodied healthy adults are more likely to have regular day jobs and not need (or want) to take on an additional temporary job that probably doesn't add that much to their paychecks.
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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby svenman » Wed May 01, 2019 3:24 pm UTC

Dauric wrote:Actually you would expect vote talliers to skew towards elderly and/or retired. It's not a high-paying job and the regularity of employment is worse than seasonal jobs (at least working seasonal happens about a quarter to a third of the year every year, vote talliers would only be employed post election for a few weeks at most). Able-bodied healthy adults are more likely to have regular day jobs and not need (or want) to take on an additional temporary job that probably doesn't add that much to their paychecks.

Well, the situation with respect to seasonal jobs in the temperate zones - where most of this forum's posters are based - may possibly not transfer well to a tropical country like Indonesia. But that's a marginal factor, most of those you've mentioned would be in effect pretty much the same in Indonesia.

If there are really so many elderly people among the volunteer vote helpers in Indonesia, then however that looks even more like expectations to get the votes tallied by a certain time have been overly highly prioritized in comparison to the wellbeing of the vote helpers. But this is the point where I'd really like some more input from someone with more insight about the situation in Indonesia in general, e.g. considering work ethos, and the makeup of the body of vote helpers there in particular.
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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby gd1 » Thu May 02, 2019 4:08 am UTC

Image

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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby CorruptUser » Sat May 04, 2019 6:17 am UTC

So, remember how there was a town in Mississippi that only integrated public schools two years ago? They still haven't figured things out, (allegedly) refusing to make a black student salutatorian out of fears that it'd scare away white residents. Because what's more terrifying than black kids proving themselves to be valuable members of society?

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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby ijuin » Sat May 04, 2019 6:02 pm UTC

Maybe because it sends the message to the white students that “you are provably inferior to those guys whom you really REALLY hate”?

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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby CorruptUser » Sat May 04, 2019 10:13 pm UTC

Not really. The vast majority of the town was black, so it would be expected that there would be a black salutatorian or whatever. And while the all black high school had better average ACT scores and whatnot, that's of the kids remaining in the school, so an underfunded school with excessive dropout rates would indeed have better than average remaining students.

In reality, black and white people arent significantly inherently different from each other beyond the ability to block UV radiation, and certainly not enough to say one is genetically superior to the other. Well, mostly; mixed race people are slightly better off, which most black people are, but then again so are most Mississippi white people not that they'd ever admit it.

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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby commodorejohn » Sun May 05, 2019 1:42 am UTC

ijuin wrote:Maybe because it sends the message to the white students that “you are provably inferior to those guys whom you really REALLY hate”?

So the solution is to kowtow to prejudice so that prejudiced people aren't made uncomfortable?

Seems reasonable.
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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby Coyne » Sun May 05, 2019 8:38 am UTC

commodorejohn wrote:
ijuin wrote:Maybe because it sends the message to the white students that “you are provably inferior to those guys whom you really REALLY hate”?

So the solution is to kowtow to prejudice so that prejudiced people aren't made uncomfortable?

Seems reasonable.


See White fragility.
In all fairness...

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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby CorruptUser » Tue May 07, 2019 4:25 am UTC

That has more to do with the "and then what" part. Many poor white people are reluctant to admit to the existence of racism because the existence of racism usually implies the need for a solution, and that solution often comes at the expense of only poor white people even as society as a whole benefits; no rich and well connected person has ever (nor will ever) been forced to give up their spot at a top university to ensure more diversity. So it's much easier to pretend racism is fake and thus any solutions are unnecessary.

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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby cyanyoshi » Wed May 15, 2019 7:54 am UTC

Wikipedia Is Now Banned in China in All Languages

A dark time for the internet itself.

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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby Chen » Wed May 15, 2019 9:55 am UTC

What is up with that last line in the article? “Wikipedia is also blocked in Turkey”. No commentary nothing just end the article with that one line.

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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby elasto » Wed May 15, 2019 11:11 am UTC

Chen wrote:What is up with that last line in the article? “Wikipedia is also blocked in Turkey”. No commentary nothing just end the article with that one line.

I guess it's because that's two year old news (though it was news to me):

Wikipedia wrote:On 29 April 2017, Turkish authorities blocked online access to all language editions of the online encyclopedia Wikipedia throughout Turkey.

The restrictions were imposed by Turkish Law No. 5651, due to the English version's article on state-sponsored terrorism, where Turkey was described as a sponsor country for ISIS and Al-Qaeda, which Turkish courts viewed as a public manipulation of mass media.

Requests by the Turkish Information and Communication Technologies Authority to edit several articles to comply with Turkish law were not acted on.

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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby Chen » Wed May 15, 2019 11:34 am UTC

I know its old (thanks to that link actually saying it when you get to the page which is actually quite a good idea) but just the way its thrown in there as the closing statement in this article feels odd.

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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby elasto » Wed May 15, 2019 11:42 am UTC

Ah.

Sadly I can't read Time's article on bans as Time bans banning ads.

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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby sardia » Wed May 15, 2019 1:04 pm UTC

elasto wrote:Ah.

Sadly I can't read Time's article on bans as Time bans banning ads.

Just open it in porn mode.

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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby solune » Wed May 15, 2019 2:17 pm UTC

Chen wrote:What is up with that last line in the article? “Wikipedia is also blocked in Turkey”. No commentary nothing just end the article with that one line.


I think it's because there's not that many countries that completely ban wikipedia in all languages.
According to this https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Censorship_of_Wikipedia, they are the only two countries that have a permanent & complete ban.

Venezuella currently bans it, but it's not official and the situation is moving
North Korea is not mentionned because North Korea.

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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby addams » Sun May 26, 2019 10:07 pm UTC

I had a hard time deciding...
Is this Funny or Tragic?

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/05/25/us/n ... imore.html

Baltimore is a Big City.
It has been stopped dead in its tracks for Three Weeks!

Three Weeks!
It is Not just some cities and some hospitals.

The Russians are in the U.S. PowerGrid.
They are inside and so comfy they have teased our engineers.

Oh...Why did I think it might be Funny?

Well...Our N>S.A. developed and used EternalBlue, the ransomware, on other nation states.
It's like taking a gun away from someone and shooting them with it. Not altogether uncommon. sigh...
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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby ObsessoMom » Mon May 27, 2019 3:58 am UTC

For Memorial Day, US Army asks Twitter, "How has serving impacted you?"

Pretty sure that the result was not how the US Army's social media team expected this to go.

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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby CorruptUser » Tue May 28, 2019 2:19 pm UTC

There no such thing as bad publicity, and no such thing as an anti-war movie...

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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby Sableagle » Tue May 28, 2019 2:44 pm UTC

CorruptUser wrote:... no such thing as an anti-war movie...
Have you seen Gallipoli?

Would you accept music videos?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=44Z5yxd59Rg
https://youtu.be/VqkFo40AvYs?t=58
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PbyqM_1vJh4
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WG48Ftsr3OI
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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby Quizatzhaderac » Tue May 28, 2019 3:03 pm UTC

I'm pretty sure CorruptUser is being sarcastic.
The thing about recursion problems is that they tend to contain other recursion problems.

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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby Sableagle » Tue May 28, 2019 3:55 pm UTC

Seems the right time and the right thread for some more videos, either way:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_NoFTpDzQZs
While collaboration between the US military and Hollywood, of course, is not a new phenomenon, few moviegoers realize how much control the Pentagon has over the American film industry.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v0rGBhhPs2c
Movies have been made in Hollywood since it was incorporated into the city of Los Angeles in 1910. These early flicks often featured military equipment in the background, such as for an air show. Nonetheless, prior to granting access to its assets, the military ensured that each scene and film reflected its values and presented its soldiers in a positive way.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FPZL5WTilRE (The 52:27 version)
Every year, Hollywood producers ask the Pentagon for help in making films, seeking everything from locations and technical advice to Blackhawk helicopters and nuclear-powered submarines. The military will happily oblige, it says in an army handbook, so long as the movie "aid[s] in the recruiting and retention of personnel." The producers want to make money; the Defense Department wants to make propaganda. Former Hollywood Reporter staffer Robb explores the conflicts resulting from these negotiations in this illuminating though sometimes tedious study of the military-entertainment complex over the last 50 years. Robb shows how, in the Nicholas Cage film Windtalkers, the Marine Corps strong-armed producers into deleting a scene where a Marine pries gold teeth from a dead Japanese soldier (a historically accurate detail). At its worst, the author argues, the Pentagon unscrupulously targets children; Robb reveals how the Defense Department helped insert military story lines into the Mickey Mouse Club. To help, Robb suggests a schedule of uniform fees by which producers could rent aircraft carriers, F-16s & the like. It's an intriguing idea, though producers can go it alone: as Robb points out, blockbusters Forrest Gump, An Officer & a Gentleman & Platoon were all made without military assistance.
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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby Mutex » Tue May 28, 2019 4:20 pm UTC

Platoon was made without military help? That's quite impressive.

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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby Quizatzhaderac » Tue May 28, 2019 5:47 pm UTC

Hmm.. I also wonder how much one can do with hollow props, CGI, and cutting in stock footage nowadays. It may not actually e that much harder to make a movie showing heavy military equipment without access to any of it.

Expertise can be acquired by hiring retired veterans directly.

Hollow props of vehicles must cost orders of magnitude less than the real things. An aircraft in the air is relatively easy to cut in, since it's not touching anything. Actual fighting needs to be fake because Hollywood isn't allowed to break the real things. Light equipment is generally available to the American consumer.
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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby cphite » Tue May 28, 2019 6:46 pm UTC

Quizatzhaderac wrote:Hmm.. I also wonder how much one can do with hollow props, CGI, and cutting in stock footage nowadays. It may not actually e that much harder to make a movie showing heavy military equipment without access to any of it.

Expertise can be acquired by hiring retired veterans directly.

Hollow props of vehicles must cost orders of magnitude less than the real things. An aircraft in the air is relatively easy to cut in, since it's not touching anything. Actual fighting needs to be fake because Hollywood isn't allowed to break the real things. Light equipment is generally available to the American consumer.


Not just the light stuff. There are plenty of companies that'll rent out heavy military vehicles to movie studios. Technically, as a private citizen you're allowed to rent or own just about anything that isn't classified. Tanks, APVs, or whatever... you need a special federal permit if the guns work, but aside from that the main obstacles are state and local traffic laws.

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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby Quizatzhaderac » Tue May 28, 2019 7:30 pm UTC

True, but I'm thinking a non-armed, non-armored, otherwise functional facsimiles of heavy equipment must be so much cheaper, even with the cost of making it custom. An Abrams tank cost 6 million, but if you can drop the guns, replace the thick steel armor with thin aluminum, and replace the power train with something less relatable that only needs to make this lighter vehicle move at the rate of a parade float?
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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby cphite » Tue May 28, 2019 8:06 pm UTC

Quizatzhaderac wrote:True, but I'm thinking a non-armed, non-armored, otherwise functional facsimiles of heavy equipment must be so much cheaper, even with the cost of making it custom. An Abrams tank cost 6 million, but if you can drop the guns, replace the thick steel armor with thin aluminum, and replace the power train with something less relatable that only needs to make this lighter vehicle move at the rate of a parade float?


Well, yeah... if you want an authentic looking Abrams you're most likely talking about a mock up - those things are expensive. So you'll either rent a much cheaper tank and throw on some fake doohickeys to make it look more Abrams-like, or you'll build something yourself. In that case, aluminum would be overkill - some good quality plywood and paint looks just as good on camera.

But for movies that feature older tanks, and for more generic vehicles, they typically just rent the actual vehicles. And for lower budget movies... they just assume nobody knows one tank from another.

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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby CorruptUser » Wed May 29, 2019 7:55 am UTC

Quizatzhaderac wrote:Expertise can be acquired by hiring retired veterans directly.


That would break Hollywood's tradition to only hire Amish writers; why else do you think Hollywood gets being a doctor, an attorney, working with computers, in the army, and being in high school so completely wrong?

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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby ObsessoMom » Wed May 29, 2019 1:25 pm UTC

This is just so horrible.

Nusrat Jahan Rafi: 16 charged in Bangladesh for burning girl alive

She was 19, which is not a "girl," but she was a student. Anyway, one wonders how many others her principal might have sexually abused and then successfully threatened into silence.

Spoiler:
The BBC wrote:Sixteen people have been charged in Bangladesh over the shocking murder of a teenager who was burned to death after reporting sexual harassment.

Nusrat Jahan Rafi, 19, was doused with kerosene and set on fire on the roof of her Islamic school on 6 April, days after filing a complaint.

Headmaster Siraj Ud Doula, targeted in the complaint, is among those charged.

Police say he ordered her murder from prison when she refused to withdraw her accusations against him.

[...]

Ms Rafi filed a police complaint against Mr Doula in late March and he was arrested. On 6 April she attended the school to sit her final exams when she was allegedly lured to the roof of the school and set alight by a group of people wearing burkas, a one-piece veil that covers the face and body.

They had planned to make it look like a suicide, police said, but Ms Rafi - who suffered burns to 80% of her body - was able to give a statement before she died on 10 April.

[...]

On 27 March, the 19-year-old accused the headmaster of the madrassa she attended of calling her into his office and repeatedly touching her in an inappropriate manner. She ran out before things could go any further.

She and her family went to the police on the same day and she gave a statement. At the police station, she was filmed by the officer in charge as she described the ordeal.

In the video she is visibly distressed and tries to hide her face with her hands. The policeman is heard calling the complaint "no big deal" and telling her to move her hands from her face. He has now been charged with illegally recording her statement and sharing it online.

The madrassa's headmaster was arrested after Ms Rafi filed her complaint, triggering street protests locally demanding his release.

[...]

According to a statement given by Nusrat, she was lured to the roof of that building by a fellow female student. She was allegedly told that one of her friends was being beaten up.

There, Mr Majumder said, she was pressured to withdraw the case and asked to sign a blank piece of paper. When she refused she was gagged and bound before being doused with kerosene and burned, he said.

In the ambulance, fearing she might not survive, she recorded a statement on her brother's mobile phone and identified some of her attackers as students at the madrassa.

"The teacher touched me, I will fight this crime till my last breath," she can be heard saying in the video.

A trial date is yet to be set.

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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby Sableagle » Wed May 29, 2019 2:38 pm UTC

I'm not normally one to call for the machine-gunning of protesters, but if there's a mob demanding that bastard be allowed to get away with it a strafing run with an eight-gun Hurricane would be absolutely wonderful.
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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby CorruptUser » Wed May 29, 2019 4:41 pm UTC

No, that would show the world that an angry mob of a few people with a heavy machine gun doesnt approve. You need to have it done through public institutions such as the courts to show them and their followers that all of society disapproves of their actions. Even if the proscribed punishment is getting machinegunned down.

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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby ucim » Wed May 29, 2019 6:01 pm UTC

CorruptUser wrote: Even if the proscribed punishment is getting machinegunned down.
That word... I don't think it means what you think it means.

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CorruptUser
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Joined: Fri Nov 06, 2009 10:12 pm UTC

Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby CorruptUser » Wed May 29, 2019 11:34 pm UTC

Yeah, I'm wrong. Basically, trying to say that all punishment should be through the justice system, even if excessively brutal, rather than vigilantes.


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