1849: "Decades"

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Re: 1849: "Decades"

Postby Wee Red Bird » Tue Jun 13, 2017 6:55 am UTC

squall_line wrote:
Wee Red Bird wrote:And while we are at it, can we all stop using 'K' in the date. Ok back in Y2K and, at a pinch, 2k4 for 2004, but some are using 2K17 for 2017. You aren't saving any characters. It isn't shorthand. Stop doing it.


The only thing that immediately jumps to my mind when I hear "2K17" is in relation to video games. Specifically, the franchises owned and published by 2K Sports use 2Kyy as their annual release number, which is one of the ways to discern between such things as the ESPN release (NBA Live) and the 2K Sports release (NBA 2K).

Outside of that specific niche, I agree that it doesn't make as much sense to use it, but I don't recall hearing it outside of that context recently, either.


WWE use it too, but have seen it around on Twitter with no reference to video games.

Urban dictionary defines 2K17 as "Mostly used by obnoxious teanaged girls on social media to state the year 2017 in the most pointless way possible"

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Re: 1849: "Decades"

Postby somitomi » Tue Jun 13, 2017 8:43 am UTC

da Doctah wrote:2000-2010 = "the twenty-hundreds"

Is this format used for numbers divisible by one thousand though?
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Re: 1849: "Decades"

Postby gmalivuk » Tue Jun 13, 2017 11:38 am UTC

No
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Re: 1849: "Decades"

Postby da Doctah » Tue Jun 13, 2017 11:46 am UTC

somitomi wrote:
da Doctah wrote:2000-2010 = "the twenty-hundreds"

Is this format used for numbers divisible by one thousand though?

All you need to make this work is simple analogy:

1899 = "eighteen ninety-nine"
1900 = "nineteen hundred"
1901 = "nineteen oh-one"

Therefore:

1999 = "nineteen ninety-nine"
2000 = "twenty hundred"
2001 = "twenty oh-one"

Someone really should have started leaning hard on this concept about twenty years ago so it would be second nature today.

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Re: 1849: "Decades"

Postby pscottdv » Tue Jun 13, 2017 12:07 pm UTC

jozwa wrote:
How did they deal with the decade names 100 years ago?


I don't know about 100 years ago, but a little later everything from 1900 up to "the great war" was called "turn of the century". Then you had "the great war" and then "the roaring 20s".

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Re: 1849: "Decades"

Postby gmalivuk » Tue Jun 13, 2017 12:49 pm UTC

da Doctah wrote:
somitomi wrote:
da Doctah wrote:2000-2010 = "the twenty-hundreds"

Is this format used for numbers divisible by one thousand though?

All you need to make this work is simple analogy:

1899 = "eighteen ninety-nine"
1900 = "nineteen hundred"
1901 = "nineteen oh-one"

Therefore:

1999 = "nineteen ninety-nine"
2000 = "twenty hundred"
2001 = "twenty oh-one"

Someone really should have started leaning hard on this concept about twenty years ago so it would be second nature today.

No, I think there's too much inertia from how we talk about other numbers. Something might cost nineteen hundred dollars and someone might live at twenty-one hundred Jump Street, but never "twenty hundred".

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Re: 1849: "Decades"

Postby Liri » Tue Jun 13, 2017 1:25 pm UTC

The New Yorker has a much more rigorous and defined editorial policy on spelling and word use relative to most other publications, and I've noticed they use " the aughts". They often plot their own course, but I wouldn't count the word out for mainstream use just yet.

As for the blurring between the aughts and the present decade, the internet made everything super accessible, and the quirky postmodernism of the 90s suddenly had far too much material to handle in any cohesive sense and a lot of things stagnated. It's taken time for a new driving focus to emerge for design, architecture, music, etc to coalesce around, which in my view is sustainability. The excesses of deregulation and hyper-development became clear in a big way while simultaneously people calmed down about the internet and learned to use it, and other emerging technologies, effectively. Folks realized they didn't really like working and living in postmodernism's cynical glass-and-steel creations. Minimalism in music joined up with jazz and rock while pop artists are increasing classically trained or inspired; modernist architecture has resurged in a solid partnership with sustainable design.

Movies I'm not sure about. I think there's been a greater degree of continuity there.
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Re: 1849: "Decades"

Postby fluffysheap » Tue Jun 13, 2017 2:02 pm UTC

Liri wrote:The New Yorker has a much more rigorous and defined editorial policy on spelling and word use relative to most other publications


Does anyone know why they put umlauts everywhere? They are not metal enough to get away with it.

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Re: 1849: "Decades"

Postby peregrine_crow » Tue Jun 13, 2017 2:44 pm UTC

Around here people seemed to have settled on referring to those decades as the zeroes and the tens. I know one person who thinks the noughties is hilarious and insists on using that, but other than that I haven't heard any of the alternatives in quite a while.
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Re: 1849: "Decades"

Postby Soupspoon » Tue Jun 13, 2017 2:57 pm UTC

da Doctah wrote:The ambiguity is resolved by the pronunciation:

2000-2100 = "the two thousands"
2000-2010 = "the twenty-hundreds"


Not...
2000-2999 = "the two thousands"
2000-2099 = "the twenty-hundreds"

..then? (Also correcting for an obvious numeric typo on your part... :P)

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Re: 1849: "Decades"

Postby Freedom 35 » Tue Jun 13, 2017 4:18 pm UTC

In the UK, 2000-2010 is commonly called "the noughties". If you google "noughties" you find references like "100 songs that defined the Noughties" (The Telegraph), "17 noughties trends you don't want to come back into fashion" (Metro) and even "What should we call the decade after the noughties?" (Daily Mirror).

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Re: 1849: "Decades"

Postby Freedom 35 » Tue Jun 13, 2017 4:23 pm UTC

da Doctah wrote:All you need to make this work is simple analogy:

1899 = "eighteen ninety-nine"
1900 = "nineteen hundred"
1901 = "nineteen oh-one"

Therefore:

1999 = "nineteen ninety-nine"
2000 = "twenty hundred"
2001 = "twenty oh-one"

Someone really should have started leaning hard on this concept about twenty years ago so it would be second nature today.


It was the same a hundred years ago. The old-timers were talking about "the year nineteen hundred and nine", which sounds really old-fashioned now that we say "nineteen oh nine" instead. When future us look back at now and see everyone saying "two thousand and twelve" instead of "twenty twelve", it'll sound similarly old-fashioned.

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Re: 1849: "Decades"

Postby Freedom 35 » Tue Jun 13, 2017 4:29 pm UTC

By the way for the current decade, I'd confidently predict it'll be "twenty tens". Never or rarely abbreviated from that. "Nineteen tens" is a common term, but I don't think "tens" was much used for that decade in the way that 1920s was shortened to "twenties", etc.

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Re: 1849: "Decades"

Postby candybrie4zo » Tue Jun 13, 2017 4:44 pm UTC

Nathan 0 wrote:I'd argue it takes 8-12 years following the close of a decade before everyone has settled on that decade's identity, and that this comic is a bit premature. Aughts and teens are awkward terms (compared to 70s, 80s, 90s), but I posit we're not yet far enough out of the aughts for the nostalgia to have started.


I don't think that's necessarily true. I know for sure we were sharing "You're a 90's kid if..." bulletins on MySpace by 2007.

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Re: 1849: "Decades"

Postby gmalivuk » Tue Jun 13, 2017 5:08 pm UTC

candybrie4zo wrote:
Nathan 0 wrote:I'd argue it takes 8-12 years following the close of a decade before everyone has settled on that decade's identity, and that this comic is a bit premature. Aughts and teens are awkward terms (compared to 70s, 80s, 90s), but I posit we're not yet far enough out of the aughts for the nostalgia to have started.

I don't think that's necessarily true. I know for sure we were sharing "You're a 90's kid if..." bulletins on MySpace by 2007.

I've already posted a link counting uses in books of each decade term. Each one starts rising within its own decade but doesn't really take off until the following one.
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Re: 1849: "Decades"

Postby Pfhorrest » Tue Jun 13, 2017 5:23 pm UTC

In my experience "the nineteen hundreds" can easily and unproblematically mean either the 20th century, or the first decade of that century, depending on context. Looking backward from the near-present, by decade, seems to favor the latter usage, while looking forward across time, by century, seems to favor the latter. Since we were just recently in that century, referring to the century as a whole seems less common than to the decade within it, so "the nineteen hundreds" usually names the first decade of last century. The second decade of that century is "the nineteen-tens", unambiguously. (Or occasionally, "the teens").

Likewise, "the two thousands" seems perfectly natural as either a name for the first decade of the 21st century, that century as a whole, or even conceivably the 3rd millennium as a whole. Since we are so close to the event right now, the decade context seems more common, so it usually names the first decade of this present century. The second (present) decade is "the twenty-tens", unambiguously. (Or occasionally, "the teens").

The (nineteen-)eighties, the (nineteen-)nineties, the two thousands, the twenty-tens, the (twenty-)twenties, the (twenty)-thirties, etc.

The seventeen-hundreds, the eighteen-hundreds, the nineteen-hundreds, the two thousands, the twenty-one-hundreds, the twenty-two-hundreds, etc.

Context.

(It would be nice if "twenty-hundred" were a thing with numbers generally, but unfortunately it's not).
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Re: 1849: "Decades"

Postby SuicideJunkie » Tue Jun 13, 2017 6:51 pm UTC

gmalivuk wrote:No, I think there's too much inertia from how we talk about other numbers. Something might cost nineteen hundred dollars and someone might live at twenty-one hundred Jump Street, but never "twenty hundred".

So, the "two grands" instead?

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Re: 1849: "Decades"

Postby The Devils Engineer » Tue Jun 13, 2017 11:32 pm UTC

jewish_scientist wrote:I predict that radio will never go away. It is the only form of entertainment a person driving can enjoy, so it is going to stay relevant until someone solves the entire field of civic engineering and traffic jams stop being a thing that exist.

P.S. If someone brings up self-driving cars I will flip out.


Hey! What about self-driving cars?......

*munches on popcorn and sits back to watch the show*.... :)
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Re: 1849: "Decades"

Postby Draco18s » Wed Jun 14, 2017 3:05 am UTC

Wikipedia's entry on Culture for the 2000s is...depressingly empty.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2000s_(decade)#Culture

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Re: 1849: "Decades"

Postby Eternal Density » Wed Jun 14, 2017 5:25 am UTC

Draco18s wrote:Wikipedia's entry on Culture for the 2000s is...depressingly empty.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2000s_(decade)#Culture
I had no idea Rolf Harris painted an official portrait of the Queen!

Somehow, I watched none of the Oscar best pictures, but played four of the games of the year. Though none in the year they released.

I suppose the internet's way of mashing and and blurring everything old and and new together has reduced the individuality of culture in the latest decades.
Oh, and the opening sentence about fashion is notable:
Fashion trends of the decade drew much inspiration from 1960s, 1970s and 1980s styles

So we just reused the good bits of the last few decades. (Except the 90s, but I repeat myself. ;) )
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Re: 1849: "Decades"

Postby sonar1313 » Wed Jun 14, 2017 1:14 pm UTC

pushingrobot wrote:When identifying music, movies, clothes, or cars:

1967 vs. 1977: easy
1977 vs. 1987: easy
1987 vs. 1997: easy
1997 vs. 2007: fairly easy
2007 vs. 2017: hard

I don't know if it's the decline of advertising and traditional media, a resurgence of 'retro' styles, high quality recording media making the past seem less 'dated', or if I'm simply showing my age, but it feels like the advance of fashion and pop culture have slowed since 2000. We're still listening to pop dance tracks, watching superhero flicks, wearing ordinary jeans and t-shirts or recycling old fashions, and driving SUVs and sedans with the same softened edges.


For me, 2007 to 2017, cars are easy. The rest, yeah, not so much. Except for one thing, which I think is a 2010's thing: High socks are back in fashion with kids. When I was in school, from about fourth grade onward (i.e. when what you wore started to matter), you wouldn't have been caught dead with your socks halfway to your knees. The lower the better, actually. Now they're walking around looking like soccer players. I don't know when that started, because I graduated high school before all these kids were born which makes me officially old, but I think it's a this-decade thing, which would make it one useful decade marker. Kind of like neon Umbros in the '90s.

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Re: 1849: "Decades"

Postby Soupspoon » Wed Jun 14, 2017 9:37 pm UTC

Hmmm, trying to remember when it was that my schooldays intersected1 with the craze was to wear odd socks, of garishly dissimilar colours. Cue parents and other elder relatives wondering if "we had another pair like that" (no, but I had a pair the opposite way round... or so I claimed, without any way of auditing the four distinct socks' respective partnerships and placings, either side of any particular household laundry day).

1 It will have happened before and since, I'm sure, but this particular time was either in primary or secondary school....

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Re: 1849: "Decades"

Postby rmsgrey » Wed Jun 14, 2017 10:13 pm UTC

Eternal Density wrote:Somehow, I watched none of the Oscar best pictures, but played four of the games of the year. Though none in the year they released.

I think I scored 3/10 on each...

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Re: 1849: "Decades"

Postby Steve the Pocket » Wed Jun 14, 2017 11:42 pm UTC

Regular Car Reviews once offhandedly referred to the 2000s as "the New Dumb", which pretty well sums up my memories of that decade. An era marked by Shrek and its even worse successors, ungodly-huge trucks masquerading as passenger vehicles, obnoxious overprocessed music, the Star Wars prequels, hand-drawn cartoons being replaced by Flash, George W. Bush, and the rise of troll culture on the Internet. Best of riddance to it.

Flumble wrote:Did people actually say "the ${decade}s" during that decade? (I was too young during the 90s to remember :oops: ) I thought people only referred to previous decades as such.

People were using "the '90s" to refer to the present day at least as far back as 1989.

fluffysheap wrote:For cars there's a good reason at least, fuel economy standards have forced every manufacturer to optimize for drag. Almost every car now has a drag coefficient below .3, which only the sleekest sports cars would have in the 90s, and nothing would have in the 70s.

Also snub noses on everything (which ironically messes with the aerodynamics) because someone figured out that pedestrians are more likely to survive getting hit if they don't roll over the roof, somehow.
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Re: 1849: "Decades"

Postby Soupspoon » Thu Jun 15, 2017 12:26 am UTC

Steve the Pocket wrote:People were using "the '90s" to refer to the present day at least as far back as 1989.

I was going to say that it was definitely established early enough in the decade itself...

Also snub noses on everything (which ironically messes with the aerodynamics) because someone figured out that pedestrians are more likely to survive getting hit if they don't roll over the roof, somehow.

Or get propelled further out into the road.. ;)

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Re: 1849: "Decades"

Postby rmsgrey » Thu Jun 15, 2017 12:58 am UTC

Katamari DaMercedes?

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Re: 1849: "Decades"

Postby Eshru » Thu Jun 15, 2017 3:13 am UTC

I'm sure that in 3 years we will have the... 8-) hindsight to answer the question of what to call these decades.

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Re: 1849: "Decades"

Postby DuckReconMajor » Thu Jun 15, 2017 8:47 pm UTC

jewish_scientist wrote:I predict that radio will never go away. It is the only form of entertainment a person driving can enjoy, so it is going to stay relevant until someone solves the entire field of civic engineering and traffic jams stop being a thing that exist.

P.S. If someone brings up self-driving cars I will flip out.

I would burn/buy CDs so I wouldn't have to listen to the radio. When I got a car with an aux jack there was no turning back. Especially once Spotify came around.

Also I don't agree with your counterexample: I'd like to have music/news/audiobook/radio on when I can finally sleep in my self driving car. :D

Re: alt text: As someone who grew up in Eastern Virginia I feel like I've heard the very station mentioned, but I think lots of stations are going to carry the same tag-line.

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Re: 1849: "Decades"

Postby chridd » Thu Jun 15, 2017 9:40 pm UTC

The Devils Engineer wrote:
jewish_scientist wrote:I predict that radio will never go away. It is the only form of entertainment a person driving can enjoy, so it is going to stay relevant until someone solves the entire field of civic engineering and traffic jams stop being a thing that exist.

P.S. If someone brings up self-driving cars I will flip out.


Hey! What about self-driving cars?......

*munches on popcorn and sits back to watch the show*.... :)
Since jewish_scientist didn't do it...
flip-out.png
flip-out.png (793 Bytes) Viewed 6459 times
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Re: 1849: "Decades"

Postby rmsgrey » Thu Jun 15, 2017 10:02 pm UTC

chridd wrote:
The Devils Engineer wrote:
jewish_scientist wrote:I predict that radio will never go away. It is the only form of entertainment a person driving can enjoy, so it is going to stay relevant until someone solves the entire field of civic engineering and traffic jams stop being a thing that exist.

P.S. If someone brings up self-driving cars I will flip out.


Hey! What about self-driving cars?......

*munches on popcorn and sits back to watch the show*.... :)
Since jewish_scientist didn't do it...flip-out.png


I'm puzzled. Why did you flop out?

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Re: 1849: "Decades"

Postby AngryPanda » Fri Jun 16, 2017 1:35 am UTC

Is "and and" merely a typo?

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Re: 1849: "Decades"

Postby mfb » Fri Jun 16, 2017 10:03 am UTC

Soupspoon wrote:
Wee Red Bird wrote:And while we are at it, can we all stop using 'K' in the date. Ok back in Y2K and, at a pinch, 2k4 for 2004, but some are using 2K17 for 2017. You aren't saving any characters. It isn't shorthand. Stop doing it.

But it's easier to chisel. You have no curves for the "K" (rather than use "◊" instead of "0"). You only need to make perfunctory curves for the "2" (can use a "Ζ", as in "Ζ◊Ι⌉" ). Because, obviously, we're all engraving our missives in stone, in this silicon-age. Well, I know I am...
It is the silicon age. Engrave it in silicon, please.
Pfhorrest wrote:(It would be nice if "twenty-hundred" were a thing with numbers generally, but unfortunately it's not).
The French way? 99 = quatre-vingt dix neuf, "four twenty ten nine"?

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Re: 1849: "Decades"

Postby Soupspoon » Fri Jun 16, 2017 11:32 am UTC

mfb wrote:
Soupspoon wrote:Because, obviously, we're all engraving our missives in stone, in this silicon-age. Well, I know I am...
It is the silicon age. Engrave it in silicon, please.
I am. Heavily doped silicon. Because both Intel and AMD have banned me from their clean-rooms, for some reason.

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Re: 1849: "Decades"

Postby dtobias » Fri Jun 16, 2017 5:44 pm UTC

Several decades had their big cultural shift in the middle of them, around the "5" year.

1945 featured the end of World War II
1955 saw the birth of the "Rock 'n Roll" era
1965 was about when the '60s transitioned from the fairly tame early '60s to the wild late '60s; it started to get "shook up" by the Kennedy assassination, but it took a couple of years for that to really kick in
1975 had the end of the Vietnam war and the final burnout of the remnants of the countercultural '60s
1995 was when the Internet exploded into the public consciousness

In contrast, 1925, 1935, and 1985 were fairly typical years of their respective decades, without big shifts.

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Re: 1849: "Decades"

Postby Pfhorrest » Fri Jun 16, 2017 6:57 pm UTC

Similarly, the iconic features of a given decade as they are remembered later seem to really gel at the end of that decade. Lots of things from my childhood that I remembered as "80s things" I later realized were almost entirely from 1990 exactly. When I see old family photos from the early 80s, everything looks like what I expect the 70s to look like, not like what I expect the 80s to look like. When I think of "90s" things, I realize I'm mostly thinking of how things were around the turn of the millennium. For my personal memory it gets a little weird later than that, because when I think of the 2000s I also think of how things were around the year 2000 (so my mental "90s" and "2000s" are all one continuous blur), but from talking with people about five years younger than me, it seems that to them "the 2000s" means things how they were around 2010, with iPhones and Facebook and whatnot, which seem to me more like "2010s" things even though they started in the 2000s. So whatever it is that this current decade will be remembered for by people in the future, we're right in the middle of it's development right now, and in a few years it will come to a head and that's what we'll be remembered for.
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Re: 1849: "Decades"

Postby Flumble » Fri Jun 16, 2017 7:49 pm UTC

This is the decade of feeling offended and terrorist attacks, right? At least I hope unusual sexualities will be more normal and less debated and terrorism/fearmongering being less prevalent next decade.
Or if "the ${decade}s" is all about music, I guess the shift back to jazzy/groovy music? I'm inclined to say *wave, but that's far from mainstream. (But who knows, maybe next decade. Fingers crossed.)

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Re: 1849: "Decades"

Postby Ae7flux » Sun Jun 18, 2017 10:11 am UTC

fluffysheap wrote:
Liri wrote:The New Yorker has a much more rigorous and defined editorial policy on spelling and word use relative to most other publications


Does anyone know why they put umlauts everywhere? They are not metal enough to get away with it.




They're diareses not umlauts - they demarcate syllables rather than altering there pronunciation. So all those people who insist on spelling 'no one' as 'noone' could just write 'noöne' and we wouldn't take it as an archaic reference to midday. I quite like them myself but English speakers tend to have the odd idea that all diacritics are pretentious or just weirdly "foreign'. (But the metalists get a pass, probably because they're all too high to care.)
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Re: 1849: "Decades"

Postby sonar1313 » Tue Jun 20, 2017 2:48 pm UTC

Flumble wrote:This is the decade of feeling offended and terrorist attacks, right? At least I hope unusual sexualities will be more normal and less debated and terrorism/fearmongering being less prevalent next decade.
Or if "the ${decade}s" is all about music, I guess the shift back to jazzy/groovy music? I'm inclined to say *wave, but that's far from mainstream. (But who knows, maybe next decade. Fingers crossed.)

Part of the problem with music as a definer of the decades is that we've gotten to a point where younger people can easily be found preferring music from the past. Another one is that social media and the intertubes have made fads come and go a lot quicker. Sure, there's still music created in this decade, and sure, songs and dances like the Dougie and Gangnam Style and whatever Macklemore was up to were pretty big-time.....and also ignored by people who prefer classic rock, and just as surely, erased by whatever came next. There's not much time for a thing to make a mark on popular culture, because Twitter gets bored and demands something new. If the Beatles had come on the scene with an appearance on the Tonight Show or something, they'd never have had the impact or lasted as long as they did by going on Ed Sullivan in the '60s.

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Re: 1849: "Decades"

Postby mfb » Sun Jun 25, 2017 9:43 am UTC

dtobias wrote:Several decades had their big cultural shift in the middle of them, around the "5" year.

1945 featured the end of World War II
1955 saw the birth of the "Rock 'n Roll" era
1965 was about when the '60s transitioned from the fairly tame early '60s to the wild late '60s; it started to get "shook up" by the Kennedy assassination, but it took a couple of years for that to really kick in
1975 had the end of the Vietnam war and the final burnout of the remnants of the countercultural '60s
1995 was when the Internet exploded into the public consciousness

In contrast, 1925, 1935, and 1985 were fairly typical years of their respective decades, without big shifts.

1933 - Nazis in Germany
1986 - Chernobyl

A bit more Europe-specific, but still with global impact.

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Re: 1849: "Decades"

Postby svenman » Mon Jun 26, 2017 10:11 am UTC

mfb wrote:1933 - Nazis in Germany
1986 - Chernobyl

A bit more Europe-specific, but still with global impact.

Also, in many European countries the great cultural shift of the sixties is in retrospect seen as most significantly connected to the year 1968.
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