1384: Krypton

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speising
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Re: 1384: Krypton

Postby speising » Mon Jun 23, 2014 9:21 pm UTC

i remember some film (or was it the series?) where supie was trapped in an elevator and lost his powers.

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Re: 1384: Krypton

Postby Tyndmyr » Mon Jun 23, 2014 9:39 pm UTC

speising wrote:i remember some film (or was it the series?) where supie was trapped in an elevator and lost his powers.


It's come up, but it's usually not the case. Part of this is just normal comic inconsistency, and part of it is power creep. Nowadays, he's normally good to fly halfway across the galaxy, punch out some A level baddy and fly back, sun be damned. Fights just fine at night, underground, whatever.

I definitely recall him running out of juice a few times, only to be repowered by exposure to the yellow sun, though. Oh, and red sun = depowering, somehow.

Superman/boy/whatever is particularly frustrating if you enjoy consistency.

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Re: 1384: Krypton

Postby rmsgrey » Mon Jun 23, 2014 10:36 pm UTC

speising wrote:i remember some film (or was it the series?) where supie was trapped in an elevator and lost his powers.


I think Lois and Clark had an episode where Lex trapped him in the dark and threw explosions at him to drain his power.

Following the Death of Superman arc in the nineties, when he got better, he was without his powers until getting zapped by the full output of a green K reactor filtered through an energy being and converted into turbo-charged yellow sunlight, saving us from ten years of comics about his powers gradually returning.

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Re: 1384: Krypton

Postby Whizbang » Tue Jun 24, 2014 12:08 am UTC

In the book "The Death And Life of Superman" (great book, if you're interested), it describes his powers to a good degree. He has a scientist friend he goes to when he needs a doctor (which isn't often, but he was interested in his limits, so he had his scientist friend run some tests). Anyway, it gave an example where Superman had fought some super villains of some sort, took a direct blast from a nuclear bomb, then stopped an earthquake or something and he was feeling tired and out of sorts for a couple of days. It then also describes a method the scientist used to calculate how fast superman recuperates in normal Earth conditions (within the atmosphere). This was important to the plot later on, so I don't want to spoil anything, but the important bit was Superman remembering how gradually his powers came, and how it did take the first 15-20 years to fully charge/grow his "battery". The take away, as I see it, is that he holds so much power that merely being in the dark for a long time (even decades) wouldn't be enough. He'd also need to fight against other titanic forces to deplete his energy reserve.

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Re: 1384: Krypton

Postby mattt » Tue Jun 24, 2014 5:18 am UTC

This was an unusually mean-spirited strip for an XKCD. Not funny.

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Re: 1384: Krypton

Postby PayasYouDraw » Tue Jun 24, 2014 6:53 am UTC

operagost wrote:
Ae7flux wrote:
da Doctah wrote:
Philbert wrote:I have been near a cry-baby (mine), but still this strip puts me off on a deep instinctive level.

I immediately got that this was about Superman, I just don't think sending away babies to exploding stars is funny. It's also an impractical and expensive way of achieving what you want.
I hope I'm missing a subtler joke.

How do you feel about putting a crying baby in a basket and setting it adrift among the bulrushes?


You mean the ancient form of deniable genocide? I'm not exactly in favour of it myself but it's only one of many horrible acts the bible tries to pass of as morally justified.

Moses' mother placed him in the basket to avoid nearly certain death at the hands of the Pharaoh's authorities.

I'll assume you aren't well read. In this narrative, the Pharaoh is what we call the "bad guy". You may have heard of him: he's the one who refused to release a bunch of de facto slaves until his son ended up dead. The Biblical account doesn't really make a solid moral statement on her action, but it's pretty clear that the infanticidal edict of the Pharaoh is positioned as a "bad thing".


If you read the narrative, the Pharaoh was the "good guy" who was happy to release the slaves, but God kept hardening his heart, because God needs dead babies.
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Re: 1384: Krypton

Postby bachaddict » Tue Jun 24, 2014 7:44 am UTC

PayasYouDraw wrote:
operagost wrote:
Ae7flux wrote:
da Doctah wrote:
Philbert wrote:I have been near a cry-baby (mine), but still this strip puts me off on a deep instinctive level.

I immediately got that this was about Superman, I just don't think sending away babies to exploding stars is funny. It's also an impractical and expensive way of achieving what you want.
I hope I'm missing a subtler joke.

How do you feel about putting a crying baby in a basket and setting it adrift among the bulrushes?


You mean the ancient form of deniable genocide? I'm not exactly in favour of it myself but it's only one of many horrible acts the bible tries to pass of as morally justified.

Moses' mother placed him in the basket to avoid nearly certain death at the hands of the Pharaoh's authorities.

I'll assume you aren't well read. In this narrative, the Pharaoh is what we call the "bad guy". You may have heard of him: he's the one who refused to release a bunch of de facto slaves until his son ended up dead. The Biblical account doesn't really make a solid moral statement on her action, but it's pretty clear that the infanticidal edict of the Pharaoh is positioned as a "bad thing".


If you read the narrative, the Pharaoh was the "good guy" who was happy to release the slaves, but God kept hardening his heart, because God needs dead babies.


If you actually read it, the pharaoh has been killing boys for a while before that happens, and God doesn't harden his heart until after he has hardened it himself several times.
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Re: 1384: Krypton

Postby azule » Tue Jun 24, 2014 8:17 am UTC

Sorry for your loss, Cervisiae Amatorem.

janhunt wrote:Re that crying baby, please see my article "A Baby Cries: How Should Parents Respond?"
http://www.naturalchild.org/jan_hunt/babycries.html
Thanks for linking to the article. Oh, that's you. Neat.

thevicente wrote:Next time you moms and dads will argue changing diapers is beautiful.
Please don't forget that not everyone is the same just because of similar circumstances (such as having a baby). I'm not very disturbed by the dead baby joke (just have a small bit of trouble finding the joke (as is true of many an xkcd)) but yeah, I'm happy to change a diaper. :)

Cervisiae Amatorem wrote:Perhaps a comic about a fiancée dying of breast cancer would be equally as endearing.
Seems fair.
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Re: 1384: Krypton

Postby PayasYouDraw » Tue Jun 24, 2014 9:21 am UTC

bachaddict wrote:
PayasYouDraw wrote:
operagost wrote:
Ae7flux wrote:
da Doctah wrote:
Philbert wrote:I have been near a cry-baby (mine), but still this strip puts me off on a deep instinctive level.

I immediately got that this was about Superman, I just don't think sending away babies to exploding stars is funny. It's also an impractical and expensive way of achieving what you want.
I hope I'm missing a subtler joke.

How do you feel about putting a crying baby in a basket and setting it adrift among the bulrushes?


You mean the ancient form of deniable genocide? I'm not exactly in favour of it myself but it's only one of many horrible acts the bible tries to pass of as morally justified.

Moses' mother placed him in the basket to avoid nearly certain death at the hands of the Pharaoh's authorities.

I'll assume you aren't well read. In this narrative, the Pharaoh is what we call the "bad guy". You may have heard of him: he's the one who refused to release a bunch of de facto slaves until his son ended up dead. The Biblical account doesn't really make a solid moral statement on her action, but it's pretty clear that the infanticidal edict of the Pharaoh is positioned as a "bad thing".


If you read the narrative, the Pharaoh was the "good guy" who was happy to release the slaves, but God kept hardening his heart, because God needs dead babies.


If you actually read it, the pharaoh has been killing boys for a while before that happens, and God doesn't harden his heart until after he has hardened it himself several times.


Well the old testament isn't one for having any good characters in it anyway, but at least the Pharaoh was willing to make up for his wrongdoings.
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Re: 1384: Krypton

Postby speising » Tue Jun 24, 2014 12:37 pm UTC

speising wrote:i remember some film (or was it the series?) where supie was trapped in an elevator and lost his powers.


oh, this bugged me. i finally found that i had misremembered the plot of superman 4; it was nuclear man who was trapped in the elevator. a creature even more addicted to sunlight than superman himself.

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Re: 1384: Krypton

Postby mathmannix » Tue Jun 24, 2014 1:21 pm UTC

bachaddict wrote:
PayasYouDraw wrote:
operagost wrote:
Ae7flux wrote:
da Doctah wrote:
Philbert wrote:I have been near a cry-baby (mine), but still this strip puts me off on a deep instinctive level.

I immediately got that this was about Superman, I just don't think sending away babies to exploding stars is funny. It's also an impractical and expensive way of achieving what you want.
I hope I'm missing a subtler joke.

How do you feel about putting a crying baby in a basket and setting it adrift among the bulrushes?


You mean the ancient form of deniable genocide? I'm not exactly in favour of it myself but it's only one of many horrible acts the bible tries to pass of as morally justified.

Moses' mother placed him in the basket to avoid nearly certain death at the hands of the Pharaoh's authorities.

I'll assume you aren't well read. In this narrative, the Pharaoh is what we call the "bad guy". You may have heard of him: he's the one who refused to release a bunch of de facto slaves until his son ended up dead. The Biblical account doesn't really make a solid moral statement on her action, but it's pretty clear that the infanticidal edict of the Pharaoh is positioned as a "bad thing".


If you read the narrative, the Pharaoh was the "good guy" who was happy to release the slaves, but God kept hardening his heart, because God needs dead babies.


If you actually read it, the pharaoh has been killing boys for a while before that happens, and God doesn't harden his heart until after he has hardened it himself several times.


Also, the Pharaoh at the time of Moses' birth was certainly not the same Pharaoh when Moses, at age 80, led the Hebrews out of Egypt at the start of the Exodus. There are most likely three different Pharaohs mentioned in the book of Exodus: one in Exodus 1:8-2:10 when Moses was born; one in the rest of Chapter 2, when Moses was 40 (implied to be the same as the first, but probably not), who is recorded to have died in Exodus 2:23; and one in Exodus 3-14 (who might have died in the Red Sea), when Moses was 80. (See Acts 7:20-34 for the two time skips.)
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Re: 1384: Krypton

Postby captaindomon » Tue Jun 24, 2014 3:27 pm UTC

I registered for the forum for the first time to comment on this. I love XKCD and have read every single comic. I have never seen something on the comic that suggests cruel violence is funny, or that the way to handle crying babies is to kill them. This is very disturbing, and I hope Randal will apologize for this one. I can't tell you how deeply disturbed I am by this one. As a father, the answer is never to think of violence with crying children. It's a really bad way to go, and this is a horrible joke. :cry:

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Re: 1384: Krypton

Postby PinkShinyRose » Tue Jun 24, 2014 4:10 pm UTC

mathmannix' sig wrote:I hear velociraptor tastes like chicken.

All this talk about dead babies made me read "chicken" as "children".

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Re: 1384: Krypton

Postby orthogon » Tue Jun 24, 2014 4:32 pm UTC

mathmannix wrote:Also, the Pharaoh at the time of Moses' birth was certainly not the same Pharaoh when Moses, at age 80, led the Hebrews out of Egypt at the start of the Exodus.

Cool, so Moses was at the top of his game at 80, whereas JC was all youthful exuberance but died tragically at 33. Kind of Mick Jagger vs Jimi Hendrix.
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Re: 1384: Krypton

Postby PayasYouDraw » Tue Jun 24, 2014 7:09 pm UTC

orthogon wrote:
mathmannix wrote:Also, the Pharaoh at the time of Moses' birth was certainly not the same Pharaoh when Moses, at age 80, led the Hebrews out of Egypt at the start of the Exodus.

Cool, so Moses was at the top of his game at 80, whereas JC was all youthful exuberance but died tragically at 33. Kind of Mick Jagger vs Jimi Hendrix.


Old testament characters have comically long lives. Noah took a century just to build his boat IIRC.
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Re: 1384: Krypton

Postby bachaddict » Tue Jun 24, 2014 9:07 pm UTC

PayasYouDraw wrote:
orthogon wrote:
mathmannix wrote:Also, the Pharaoh at the time of Moses' birth was certainly not the same Pharaoh when Moses, at age 80, led the Hebrews out of Egypt at the start of the Exodus.

Cool, so Moses was at the top of his game at 80, whereas JC was all youthful exuberance but died tragically at 33. Kind of Mick Jagger vs Jimi Hendrix.


Old testament characters have comically long lives. Noah took a century just to build his boat IIRC.


That was some boat he built though!
slinches wrote:Also, the OTC isn't a disease. In fact, it's the cure. As we all know, Time heals all wounds.

Thanks for the molpish wig ggh!
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Re: 1384: Krypton

Postby Pfhorrest » Tue Jun 24, 2014 9:34 pm UTC

I recall reading somewhere that the word that gets translated as "year" may be more accurately translated as something like "season" and correspond to like a half or a quarter of a year. Anybody have any better information about that?
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Re: 1384: Krypton

Postby speising » Tue Jun 24, 2014 9:41 pm UTC

there are also theories that some biblical years are moon years, aka months. that would make methusalahs 969 years more reasonable.

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Re: 1384: Krypton

Postby pixeldigger » Tue Jun 24, 2014 9:47 pm UTC

I considered that the annoying baby may BE the baby on Krypton, so they decide to blow up Krypton only to find, ironically, that they send the crying baby to them before the missile exploded!

then I actually read the comic again and decided Randal just likes killing babies. :|

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Re: 1384: Krypton

Postby Pfhorrest » Wed Jun 25, 2014 12:22 am UTC

speising wrote:there are also theories that some biblical years are moon years, aka months. that would make methusalahs 969 years more reasonable.

But it would make Moses only six when he lead the exodus.
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Re: 1384: Krypton

Postby HES » Wed Jun 25, 2014 12:25 am UTC

Well that puts a whole new spin on things
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Re: 1384: Krypton

Postby firesoul31 » Wed Jun 25, 2014 1:20 am UTC

Cervisiae Amatorem wrote:There's no describing the sadness of losing a baby. I'm grateful every time I hear my son's cry, because it fills the deafening silence where my daughter's should be.

Perhaps a comic about a fiancée dying of breast cancer would be equally as endearing.


How's this?
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Re: 1384: Krypton

Postby addams » Wed Jun 25, 2014 6:07 am UTC

cellocgw wrote:
orthogon wrote:Also, I always presumed that the whole point of this forum was to provide a space in which each comic can be comprehensively overthought.


I think you're overthinking the reasoning behind the forum :twisted:

Overthinking is fine.
It's what we do;
When we are thinking at all.

We also do the research.
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Re: 1384: Krypton

Postby PayasYouDraw » Wed Jun 25, 2014 8:50 am UTC

Pfhorrest wrote:
speising wrote:there are also theories that some biblical years are moon years, aka months. that would make methusalahs 969 years more reasonable.

But it would make Moses only six when he lead the exodus.


Maybe that episode of the Rugrats was more accurate than I thought.
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Re: 1384: Krypton

Postby orthogon » Wed Jun 25, 2014 9:09 am UTC

PayasYouDraw wrote:
Pfhorrest wrote:
speising wrote:there are also theories that some biblical years are moon years, aka months. that would make methusalahs 969 years more reasonable.

But it would make Moses only six when he lead the exodus.


Maybe that episode of the Rugrats was more accurate than I thought.

So was the Simpsons Bible Stories episode...
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Re: 1384: Krypton

Postby mathmannix » Wed Jun 25, 2014 12:46 pm UTC

Pfhorrest wrote:
speising wrote:there are also theories that some biblical years are moon years, aka months. that would make methusalahs 969 years more reasonable.

But it would make Moses only six when he lead the exodus.


And as a better comparison, from the same chapter (Genesis 5), Enoch (father of Methuselah) was 65 when his son Methuselah was born. If you divide this number by any more than 4 or so (interpreting as seasons?), it doesn't make sense. Enoch lived between his father Jared (962 years) and his son Methuselah (969 years), and if you divide those by 4 you still get people living into their 240s. Basically, if you believe the Bible enough to think that the numbers are at all reflections of reality, then you accept that people lived longer before the Flood, and you might as well accept that the years are the same as ours; it's simpler that way (Occam's razor and all that.) But, if you don't believe Genesis 5 is at all literal, then you have no problem rejecting it.
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Re: 1384: Krypton

Postby Klear » Wed Jun 25, 2014 1:39 pm UTC

captaindomon wrote:I love XKCD and have read every single comic. I have never seen something on the comic that suggests cruel violence is funny, (...)


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Re: 1384: Krypton

Postby mathmannix » Wed Jun 25, 2014 2:53 pm UTC

captaindomon wrote:I registered for the forum for the first time to comment on this. I love XKCD and have read every single comic. I have never seen something on the comic that suggests cruel violence is funny, or that the way to handle crying babies is to kill them. This is very disturbing, and I hope Randal will apologize for this one. I can't tell you how deeply disturbed I am by this one. As a father, the answer is never to think of violence with crying children. It's a really bad way to go, and this is a horrible joke. :cry:


As Klear pointed out, Randall is more than capable of suggesting a violent response to something mildly annoying, and at least in this (Krypton) comic, part of the humor is that the response is completely out of proportion. Not only is it obviously wrong to kill/abandon a baby for crying, whether yours or someone else's, but it is also completely impractical to build a rocket simply to send a baby to a far-away planet just because you are annoyed. This is referenced in the title/alternate text, which shows all the couple really cares about is to have the baby out of earshot.

That being said, I too have read every single comic, and I love XKCD in general, but I disagree with the author on a number of issues, and I certainly don't love every comic. And Randall doesn't try to make a comic just so people will love it - he doesn't have to; he can make the comic however he pleases. It's not like he has to worry that a bunch of newspapers are going to drop their subscriptions, as might concern the author of a traditional comic strip. It is, of course, axiomatically impossible to please all the people all the time. But because I love some of the XKCD comics so very, very much, and I have the cognitive bias of an optimistic memory, I can say I love XKCD.

P.S. - I didn't absolutely love this comic, partly because I am a father with a baby that sometimes cries, but I did enjoy it, because it referenced Superman.
I hear velociraptor tastes like chicken.

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Re: 1384: Krypton

Postby Coyoty » Wed Jun 25, 2014 7:08 pm UTC

PinkShinyRose wrote:
mathmannix' sig wrote:I hear velociraptor tastes like chicken.

All this talk about dead babies made me read "chicken" as "children".


Children taste nothing like velociraptors.

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Re: 1384: Krypton

Postby speising » Wed Jun 25, 2014 7:19 pm UTC

i wouldn't know. i've never tried velociraptor.

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Re: 1384: Krypton

Postby Coyoty » Wed Jun 25, 2014 7:26 pm UTC

speising wrote:i wouldn't know. i've never tried velociraptor.


You wouldn't like it. They're nothing but bones. Very dry, too.

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Re: 1384: Krypton

Postby freezeblade » Wed Jun 25, 2014 7:49 pm UTC

Coyoty wrote:
PinkShinyRose wrote:
mathmannix' sig wrote:I hear velociraptor tastes like chicken.

All this talk about dead babies made me read "chicken" as "children".


Children taste nothing like velociraptors.


of course not, they taste like pork!
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Re: 1384: Krypton

Postby addams » Thu Jun 26, 2014 4:43 am UTC

Life is, just, an exchange of electrons; It is up to us to give it meaning.

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Some of us see The Gutter.
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Re: 1384: Krypton

Postby Vir4030 » Thu Jun 26, 2014 4:43 pm UTC

mathmannix wrote:it is also completely impractical to build a rocket simply to send a baby to a far-away planet just because you are annoyed.


It is also completely unbelievable from a science standpoint. So they see the planet becoming unstable in a telescope, looking at light which is a (distant) number of years old. Then they send a (supposedly) non-relativistic rocket on a trip at least that many years long. Finally, that rocket arrives just as the planet explodes.

It's not only mean-spirited, but it doesn't make any sense. Neither of these things are what I generally expect from xkcd.

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Re: 1384: Krypton

Postby Red Hal » Fri Jun 27, 2014 9:26 am UTC

See, the thing is, I didn't find it offensive at all. Nor do I think Randall should apologise (as has been mooted here). Nor should he feel the need to change the comic, withdraw the comic or indeed respond in any way. I just didn't find it funny. It could have been the day, other factors in my life, parenthood, incidents during early parenthood, a sore neck; indeed any number of confounding factors could have contributed. The plain fact of the matter is that I don't tend to find dead baby jokes funny. That's it. The world would be a boring place if we all had the same sense of humour.

Actually, that's not true, the world would probably be an extremely funny place if we all had the same sense of humour, there'd be a lot more cross-cultural jokes for a start, people would be able to find common ground through laughing at fart gags (if that was one of the things we all found funny), there would probably be fewer conflicts ... Anyway, where was I? Oh yes. I don't think this was an objectively bad comic, it just didn't work for me. No biggy. Well, maybe big enough to tell the world that I didn't find it funny in the comments section (here).

Edited for readability.
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Re: 1384: Krypton

Postby orthogon » Fri Jun 27, 2014 10:58 am UTC

Red Hal wrote:... there'd be a lot more cross-cultural jokes for a start, people would be able to find common ground through laughing at fart gags (if that was one of the things we all found funny) ...

Wait, there are people that don't find fart gags funny?
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Re: 1384: Krypton

Postby Whizbang » Fri Jun 27, 2014 12:15 pm UTC

I gag on farts.

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Re: 1384: Krypton

Postby Coyoty » Fri Jun 27, 2014 3:24 pm UTC

Whizbang wrote:I gag on farts.


Running farts are good for running gags.

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addams
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Re: 1384: Krypton

Postby addams » Sat Jun 28, 2014 5:32 am UTC

Coyoty wrote:
Whizbang wrote:I gag on farts.


Running farts are good for running gags.

Finely.
Someone found a funny.

Horses and Joggers.(right?)
They fart when they run.

Are you a Jogger?
I know you are not a horse.
Horses dont type.
Life is, just, an exchange of electrons; It is up to us to give it meaning.

We are all in The Gutter.
Some of us see The Gutter.
Some of us see The Stars.
by mr. Oscar Wilde.

Those that want to Know; Know.
Those that do not Know; Don't tell them.
They do terrible things to people that Tell Them.


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