Brooklyn 99 Mafia: Halloween Heist - Day 6 - Ultimate Mammal Sash Genius

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Zenii
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Re: Brooklyn 99 Mafia: Halloween Heist - Day 2: Sashtag

Postby Zenii » Mon Nov 12, 2018 7:24 am UTC

im not sure would i be notified? never had it before. ill ask

pretty busy as well dont expect much from me

slow posters nows your time to shine!

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Re: Brooklyn 99 Mafia: Halloween Heist - Day 2: Sashtag

Postby Vicarin » Mon Nov 12, 2018 7:25 am UTC

mpolo wrote:A full reads list is going to have to wait until Wednesday or Thursday, when I have a computer to be able to go through this.

I am assuming that there was some protection going on in the course of the night. After all, Sabrar isn't there to do a withhold Gambit. Ninja: or bulletproof

Plytho was apparently completely honest with us - which was pretty much my read. There is probably scum on that wagon, but I still think the lead there was coming from a townie place.

I am a self-watcher and saw the sash without being able to steal it (I have a chance to steal from anyone who visits me) which means that I know within three people who had the sash at some point in the night - presumably it could have moved on later in the night.


Oh, fascinating.

So your self-watcher was able to tell you that one of the 3 people who targeted you was the person to have the Sash originally? I can work with that. Also, that's a hell of a lot of targets on you :P.

Btw, If someone tries claiming that plytho had it originally, and they 'happened' to get it upon the lynch, I'm not believing them.

Anyone want to own up to having the Sash yet? :lol:

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Re: Brooklyn 99 Mafia: Halloween Heist - Day 2: Sashtag

Postby jimbobmacdoodle » Mon Nov 12, 2018 8:44 am UTC

Morning all. First up, I have information about who had the sash yesterday that is more useful in this area than mpolo's. I will hold off revealing more for a moment though, a) so that everybody has a chance to claim they currently have the sash (I'd rather any information I give away doesn't further affect people's willingness to be truthful), and b) to see if anybody has any thoughts about who reveals their information first out of me and mpolo. I'm happy to reveal mine later today and first (I think it makes more sense that way around).

@Zenii, why the switch on me suddenly?

Also, I don't think you ever answered my question about your town read on bessie? Why not? Your big reads list didn't even rely explain it.

Zenii being bulletproof is a reasonable explanation for a lack of kill. I'd be amazed by a withhold, given we had an even number of players as such a play would grant an extra mislynch on top of the other issues with withholding. I don't think it's a good idea for other roles to claim they (might have) prevented the kill.

@mpolo, somitomi, why didn't you vote?

Thinking about mpolo and somitomi's lack of a vote last night, and my first instinct is that Town!BoomFrog would actually make it more likely that scum!them would vote: they know that not voting is suspicious, especially in a tight race. Need to think about this some more though.

Will go back and respond to end of D1 posts this evening.
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Re: Brooklyn 99 Mafia: Halloween Heist - Day 2: Sashtag

Postby jimbobmacdoodle » Mon Nov 12, 2018 11:08 am UTC

One more question to bessie: did you have the sash yesterday? If you don't want to answer, please explain why not.
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Re: Brooklyn 99 Mafia: Halloween Heist - Day 1 - A-Sashin's Creed

Postby somitomi » Mon Nov 12, 2018 12:15 pm UTC

Belated End of Day One Reads&Impressions

Disclaimer: I wrote this into a text file over the weekend and posted it as is
Disclaimer Two: Don't expect this to be complete in any way.

As mentioned before I'm a little overwhelmed by D1, but I also noted how quickly reads seem to solidify. Zen in particular burst through the door with a scumread on LaserGuy (based on the timing of his confirmation) and Vicarin (based on a single game post). These could be a joke, but he still defended the LG read on page four, which is weird. In general, I don't like his cocky but ever-so-slightly tongue-in-cheek tone. As BoomFrog pointed out, this makes it easier for Zen to hide his actual intentions.
Aside: I don't really know what to make of BoomFrog and Zen openly buddying each other like this. I feel like BoomFrog and Zenii are the sort of players to do this as a team, because "scum would never do this".
On a related note, I recall plytho claiming some earlier post was sarcastic, but I couldn't detect any hint of that in the posts themselves. Additionally, after rereading (again), I still find LaserGuy's case on him convincing.
The third player I'm suspicious of at the moment is Mark. Him retracting the question doesn't really make sense as either alignment, so I'd call that NAI, but other things pinged me in later posts. The way he came to my defense after Zen's vote is odd. Then he didn't really explain why he called for mpolo of all people to be vigged.
Zenii wrote:That being said, I'm confident we can hold up our deal of the bargain. It's in scum's best interest to avoid killing indy and aim for town. They can best avoid indy if indy claims. It's in our best interest for indy to claim so that we can narrow the pool of scumspects. Indy claiming is beneficial on all sides.

How would we know the claimed indie isn't actually mafia?
bessie wrote:somitomi – I’m sorry you had to replace on D1 as scum.

Fixed that for you.

TOWN
Jimbob
Mpolo
LaserGuy
bessie
Vicarin
Boomfrog
Mark
plytho
zenii
SCUM
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Re: Brooklyn 99 Mafia: Halloween Heist - Day 2: Sashtag

Postby mpolo » Mon Nov 12, 2018 12:19 pm UTC

I was in meetings all day Friday afternoon and Saturday and forgot to check in. I was voting Boomfrog at one point, became convinced otherwise, and was never truly convinced of the plytho wagon. Which means I really don't know who I would have voted for if I had remembered to come back in time.
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Re: Brooklyn 99 Mafia: Halloween Heist - Day 2: Sashtag

Postby somitomi » Mon Nov 12, 2018 12:40 pm UTC

BoomFrog wrote:
Vicarin wrote:If someone suggests something that makes incredibly little sense from the PoV of good town strategy, you think they should be town read for that?

Depends on context, but yes, because scum wouldn't do that on purpose and would double check themselves.

I think this has been discussed before, so I think scum could "make a mistake" to seem townie. On the whole I think bad strategy isn't alignment indicative, scum can actually make a mistake too, even if they're more cautious.
Zenii wrote:im not sure would i be notified? never had it before. ill ask

Wait, but then why are you coonfirmed town?
jimbobmacdoodle wrote:@mpolo, somitomi, why didn't you vote?

This, I was a little busy on Friday and couldn't really digest things to my satisfaction.
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Re: Brooklyn 99 Mafia: Halloween Heist - Day 2: Sashtag

Postby Vicarin » Mon Nov 12, 2018 1:22 pm UTC

@somitomi: why on earth do you find mpolo and Jimbob so townie?

@jimbob: ooooh, more information, my favourite! You're right about getting people to Sash claim before revealing it though. Guess I'll just have to wait :(.

@all: I'm kind of surprised at people taking Zen's bulletproof claim at face value seeing as he'd realistically need another ability to trigger Heist at all. Yes, I know plytho had a sash cop apparently, but there's only so many minor abilities that can fit into a game this size. Then again, mpolo apparently got targeted by 3 people...

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Re: Brooklyn 99 Mafia: Halloween Heist - Day 2: Sashtag

Postby bessie » Mon Nov 12, 2018 4:01 pm UTC

jimbobmacdoodle wrote:One more question to bessie: did you have the sash yesterday? If you don't want to answer, please explain why not.
Scum does not need a power to deduce that I had the sash yesterday. All they needed was to confirm in scum chat that their partner(s) didn’t have it.

jimbobmacdoodle wrote: b) to see if anybody has any thoughts about who reveals their information first out of me and mpolo. I'm happy to reveal mine later today and first (I think it makes more sense that way around).
I think that mpolo has not been entirely truthful in his claims, but I also believe mpolo is not mafia, so you can claim first if you wish.

@somitomi – I don’t see why that quote needed fixing.

I’ll probably be at work late tonight, I’ve been gone for a week.

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Re: Brooklyn 99 Mafia: Halloween Heist - Day 2: Sashtag

Postby jimbobmacdoodle » Mon Nov 12, 2018 4:43 pm UTC

bessie wrote:
jimbobmacdoodle wrote:One more question to bessie: did you have the sash yesterday? If you don't want to answer, please explain why not.
Scum does not need a power to deduce that I had the sash yesterday. All they needed was to confirm in scum chat that their partner(s) didn’t have it.

jimbobmacdoodle wrote: b) to see if anybody has any thoughts about who reveals their information first out of me and mpolo. I'm happy to reveal mine later today and first (I think it makes more sense that way around).
I think that mpolo has not been entirely truthful in his claims, but I also believe mpolo is not mafia, so you can claim first if you wish.
Thank you. That makes sense to me. I will continue to wait to see if anybody claims if they have the sash before revealing my information. For the record, I do not have it.

More later this evening.
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Re: Brooklyn 99 Mafia: Halloween Heist - Day 2: Sashtag

Postby BoomFrog » Mon Nov 12, 2018 4:44 pm UTC

Vicarin wrote:[Many objections to Boomfrog's plan]
I have good answers to all of that but with the BP claim it's moot for now, so better to not get into the details.
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Re: Brooklyn 99 Mafia: Halloween Heist - Day 2: Sashtag

Postby BoomFrog » Mon Nov 12, 2018 4:47 pm UTC

I think mpolo shouldn't claim who targeted them. Obfuscating towns powers is more important then what I think we will get from him claiming. But that may depend on JimBob's claim.
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Re: Brooklyn 99 Mafia: Halloween Heist - Day 2: Sashtag

Postby BoomFrog » Mon Nov 12, 2018 4:52 pm UTC

bessie wrote:
jimbobmacdoodle wrote:One more question to bessie: did you have the sash yesterday? If you don't want to answer, please explain why not.
Scum does not need a power to deduce that I had the sash yesterday. All they needed was to confirm in scum chat that their partner(s) didn’t have it.
An indy sash holder was possible. But yes, I think anyone who targeted Bessie is scummy (unless it's Vic maybe).

I think that mpolo has not been entirely truthful in his claims, but I also believe mpolo is not mafia.

Woof!
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Re: Brooklyn 99 Mafia: Halloween Heist - Day 2: Sashtag

Postby BoomFrog » Mon Nov 12, 2018 4:59 pm UTC

LaserGuy wrote:If there's scum on the BoomFrog wagon, it's probably jimbob.
Why?

somitomi and mpolo both look very bad for not being involved in a tight lynch. Good chance of scum in this group if BoomFrog is Town. If not, probably at least one indie.
What do you think of their explanations?

I think if Boom is Town, probably one scum in {Vic, jimbob} and one in {mpolo, somitomi}. If Boom is scum, the partner is... :? Probably bessie, I guess.
Why is Vic not a likely scum partner of mine, but is likely scum if I'm town?

When you placed your final vote D1:
What was your confidence that plytho was town?
That I was scum?

What's your confidence that I'm scum now?
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Re: Brooklyn 99 Mafia: Halloween Heist - Day 2: Sashtag

Postby BoomFrog » Mon Nov 12, 2018 5:00 pm UTC

Quote fixing:
LaserGuy wrote:If there's scum on the BoomFrog wagon, it's probably jimbob.
Why?

somitomi and mpolo both look very bad for not being involved in a tight lynch. Good chance of scum in this group if BoomFrog is Town. If not, probably at least one indie.
What do you think of their explanations?

I think if Boom is Town, probably one scum in {Vic, jimbob} and one in {mpolo, somitomi}. If Boom is scum, the partner is... :? Probably bessie, I guess.
Why is Vic not a likely scum partner of mine, but is likely scum if I'm town?

When you placed your final vote D1:
What was your confidence that plytho was town?
That I was scum?

What's your confidence that I'm scum now?
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Re: Brooklyn 99 Mafia: Halloween Heist - Day 1 - A-Sashin's Creed

Postby jimbobmacdoodle » Mon Nov 12, 2018 9:16 pm UTC

Starting off with posts since my last main post (not counting the quick check-in this afternoon) (spoilered for length).
Spoiler:
somitomi wrote:Aside: I don't really know what to make of BoomFrog and Zen openly buddying each other like this. I feel like BoomFrog and Zenii are the sort of players to do this as a team, because "scum would never do this".
I wouldn't read anything into this. It's basically an in joke, as far as I understand it.
somitomi wrote:Additionally, after rereading (again), I still find LaserGuy's case on him convincing.
Who is the "him" you are referring to here?

somitomi wrote:
Zenii wrote:That being said, I'm confident we can hold up our deal of the bargain. It's in scum's best interest to avoid killing indy and aim for town. They can best avoid indy if indy claims. It's in our best interest for indy to claim so that we can narrow the pool of scumspects. Indy claiming is beneficial on all sides.

How would we know the claimed indie isn't actually mafia?
I've been thinking about Zenii's comments here a bit more. Originally, I took this as a gambit to try to flush out indies early on, so we could ignore them. I was reminded of the gambit one player used in Smalltown 2 to try to flush out the druids in that game (an indie pair who had to die in the same manner, IIRC) in a similar manner: offer a deal that we'd co-ordinate their deaths as town accordingly. Of course, the real plan was to just ignore them if they claimed (there weren't any as it turned out).
@Zenii - do you still stand by your original comments as expressed, or were you actually doing a gambit along the lines of what I described?
somitomi wrote:
jimbobmacdoodle wrote:@mpolo, somitomi, why didn't you vote?

This, I was a little busy on Friday and couldn't really digest things to my satisfaction.
I'm willing to buy mpolo's reasoning, but somitomi, you are aware that if you fail to vote, you are effectively giving greater control to scum for the vote. It also makes it harder to read you, so you really MUST have a vote down on somebody. Presumably you had a vague idea of who you either felt scummy or townie, in which case, you should have voted them/sheeped them respectively at the least.
Vicarin wrote:@somitomi: why on earth do you find mpolo and Jimbob so townie?
I want to know the answer to this too...
Vicarin wrote:@all: I'm kind of surprised at people taking Zen's bulletproof claim at face value seeing as he'd realistically need another ability to trigger Heist at all. Yes, I know plytho had a sash cop apparently, but there's only so many minor abilities that can fit into a game this size. Then again, mpolo apparently got targeted by 3 people...
I'm accepting it as a possible explanation for the lack of a kill. It may not be the real reason though. (I could just see Sabrar pulling a "withhold and claim bulletproof" gambit, and I see no reason why Zenii wouldn't be that way either). What makes you think that Zenii has no other abilities?
Current sash claims for D2 (please claim if you haven't already):
Spoiler:
Jimbob - no
Vicarin - not explicit, but implied no sash.
mpolo - no

@bessie, BoomFrog, LaserGuy, Mark_Cangila, somitomi, Zenii - please claim if you currently have the sash or not.

I've been thinking about mpolo's claim a bit. @mpolo, please can you confirm that you steal the sash by the sash holder visiting you and not you visiting the sash holder.

Earlier D2 content:
Spoiler:
@bessie - this answer doesn't explain the reason for your FoSses:
bessie wrote:My FoS list is independent of my reads list.

BoomFrog wrote:Wait, no one got NKed. That's good.
You didn't notice this already? *insert sceptical bessie dog image here*
BoomFrog wrote:Alright, I got it. I propose everyone should claim if they know they were roleblocked or not. Once that's done, if a roleblocker did target someone that didn't claim then the roleblocker should reveal their action. This will force scum to claim they were roleblocked without having the roleblocker outed. Then we will know to pay extra attention to that person. If there was no roleblocking then any existing doctor can surmise that their target is very likely town. Thoughts?
Vicarin already pointed out various issues with this plan. I can't see how BoomFrog could have thought this was a good idea. Mind you, plytho also posted a bad plan earlier.

@BoomFrog, I'd like your answer to at least the point about how does this plan work with your ability.


Remaining D1 content:
Spoiler:
bessie wrote:What do you see as my and plytho’s argument, and what are the answers to the questions in this post that I missed? Post in this format:

bessie wrote:1. Y or N?
2. Y or N?
3. Y or N?
As far as I understood it, you didn't believe plytho's claim, or something to that effect, and you were trying to get him to answer things in such a way that he might "slip" that his role PM didn't contain the town role PM (this all assumes you are town yourself of course, which I'm not convinced about). Either that or you thought he had slipped indie or scum by discussing his "personal win condition" (which he almost certainly meant was the one in the rules post). To answer the questions:
1. N, if you are referring to the win condition in the role PM.
2. That depends on what you mean by single ability, but Y in the sense that kill implies stealing sash, N in the sense that they will be written as a single ability in the role PM.
3. I don't have any real evidence to this one but I imagine N was the answer, or he would have clarified this as town at some point.

Zenii wrote:More concrete reason why bessie is town: doesn't care about being seen as sash holder. Scum would want to avoid being targeted by ppl tryna obtain it.
This logic doesn't make sense. Scum would be more than happy for people to target them if they hold the sash, since it makes them immune (oh, I see Vicarin mentioned this later, I'd still like Zenii's comments on this though). Note that bessie did in fact have the sash according to her recent claim.
Zenii wrote:
what is a plytho anyway wrote:Boomfrog's claim: do you agree it's not a safe claim.
I don't think he made it up. I think it's his legit scum role. Possibly even a safe that overlaps with his actual role.
@boom, with so much analysis I'm happy to sheep you!
This doesn't add up either. In the same post you both say that Boom is scum, and then say that you are happy to sheep him. Which is it? If both, why are you happy to sheep scum!Boom? If only one, why did you say the other?
bessie wrote:Where was it discussed that a killer automatically gets the sash if they kill the sash holder? Except with plytho I guess, since you believe he has “implied-claimed” this.
I went back and looked at the rules post, and the heist ability is described as simply when you target a player you might get to steal the sash (paraphrased slightly). Is it not clear in your role that this is the case?
Vicarin wrote:I don't seriously think bessie has the Sash
What made you think that?
Vicarin wrote:Aww, plytho pointed out what was weird about BoomFrog's claim, he got the name of the dog wrong. As I said, I think this mistake is a bit more likely to come from town.
I'm not sure I follow why BoomFrog's mistake is more likely to come from town...

@BoomFrog - care to comment on the whole issue of you getting the dog name wrong?
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Re: Brooklyn 99 Mafia: Halloween Heist - Day 2: Sashtag

Postby Zenii » Mon Nov 12, 2018 10:00 pm UTC

Zenii wrote:im not sure would i be notified? never had it before. ill ask
false alarm

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Re: Brooklyn 99 Mafia: Halloween Heist - Day 2: Sashtag

Postby Zenii » Mon Nov 12, 2018 10:02 pm UTC

i dont have the sash
jim i gave my reason for town bessie at end of day also just tone. ive claimed a 100% on bessie before and've been wrong though so take with a grain of salt

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Re: Brooklyn 99 Mafia: Halloween Heist - Day 1 - A-Sashin's Creed

Postby Zenii » Mon Nov 12, 2018 10:08 pm UTC

somitomi wrote:
Zenii wrote:somi. I agree with the points bessie made about wam. I also think wam was playing to his scum meta. I don't think townSomi could have have really gained an impression on plytho just from Laser's summary that I linked. The addition of the rushing things helps scum line felt like scum playing the good townie. 65

I didn't write that after reading only the linked post, I skimmed the entire thread by that time. Sorry if I didn't make that clear...
Vicarin wrote:somitomi and Mark, at least post an ordered list before the day ends, I have no idea where you stand on most people. mpolo could probably do so too, but I've got a bit more of an idea from this last page.
ok then what's your reasoning. please in detail explain what you found scummy about plytho at the time

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Re: Brooklyn 99 Mafia: Halloween Heist - Day 2: Sashtag

Postby jimbobmacdoodle » Mon Nov 12, 2018 10:08 pm UTC

Zenii wrote:
Zenii wrote:im not sure would i be notified? never had it before. ill ask
false alarm
I'm confused a bit by this...? What is a false alarm?
Zenii wrote:i dont have the sash
jim i gave my reason for town bessie at end of day also just tone. ive claimed a 100% on bessie before and've been wrong though so take with a grain of salt
Thank you. Sorry, I was expecting a little more reasoning than "you can see the gears turning" from such a confident read, that's all. Also, note mine and Vicarin's comments that her not caring about being seen with the sash is not necessarily townie. Was there anything else that I missed?
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Re: Brooklyn 99 Mafia: Halloween Heist - Day 1 - A-Sashin's Creed

Postby BoomFrog » Mon Nov 12, 2018 10:11 pm UTC

jimbobmacdoodle wrote:
BoomFrog wrote:Wait, no one got NKed. That's good.
You didn't notice this already? *insert sceptical bessie dog image here*
I got to the part about plytho being town and went off to think about the implications. It was later when I was trying to think through each player I was like, "Wait, who died?" and went back to check. (Yeah, I wouldn't believe me either)

@BoomFrog, I'd like your answer to at least the point about how does this plan work with your ability.
Well, I'd be happy for a roleblocker to challenge me and claim that they roleblocked me, since that would be incredibly scummy of them seeing as I'm trying to prove my power. Also, the more we discuss powers the more role info people will leak so I really think we should drop this topic, and you should probably drop the questioning of Bessie on her sash gaining mechanics.

Vicarin wrote:Aww, plytho pointed out what was weird about BoomFrog's claim, he got the name of the dog wrong. As I said, I think this mistake is a bit more likely to come from town.
I'm not sure I follow why BoomFrog's mistake is more likely to come from town...

@BoomFrog - care to comment on the whole issue of you getting the dog name wrong?
Vic is correctly assuming that I was claiming from memory which implies that I read the role PM at the beginning of the game and didn't just freshly look up a character from a wiki or something. I think he is assuming that that means I must have a town role PM but it really is only evidence that I didn't lie about my rolename. Which I guess is very slightly townie, but I wouldn't count it for much.

btw, no sash.
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Re: Brooklyn 99 Mafia: Halloween Heist - Day 2: Sashtag

Postby Zenii » Mon Nov 12, 2018 10:12 pm UTC

i wasn't aware id be notified if my bp depleted. i wasnt the target last night

agree with bessie point now that i know that people can get the sash from being targeted ill reevaluate.

i havent had time to read the posts from this page just skimmed

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Re: Brooklyn 99 Mafia: Halloween Heist - Day 1 - A-Sashin's Creed

Postby BoomFrog » Mon Nov 12, 2018 10:16 pm UTC

BoomFrog wrote:
Mark_Cangila wrote:I support a Boom lynch and an mpolo vig. Mpolo has been too quiet and under the rader.

Why not answer my questions?

Reminder I'd still like to talk about this.
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Re: Brooklyn 99 Mafia: Halloween Heist - Day 2: Sashtag

Postby BoomFrog » Mon Nov 12, 2018 10:17 pm UTC

Zenii wrote:i wasn't aware id be notified if my bp depleted. i wasnt the target last night

/slowclap

Alright, I'm open to resuming discussion on why my roleblock claiming plan will work. Answers coming soon.
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BoomFrog
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Re: Brooklyn 99 Mafia: Halloween Heist - Day 1 - A-Sashin's Creed

Postby BoomFrog » Mon Nov 12, 2018 10:21 pm UTC

jimbobmacdoodle wrote:
Zenii wrote:
what is a plytho anyway wrote:Boomfrog's claim: do you agree it's not a safe claim.
I don't think he made it up. I think it's his legit scum role. Possibly even a safe that overlaps with his actual role.
@boom, with so much analysis I'm happy to sheep you!
This doesn't add up either. In the same post you both say that Boom is scum, and then say that you are happy to sheep him. Which is it? If both, why are you happy to sheep scum!Boom? If only one, why did you say the other?

How is your reading comprehension this bad? Like really, how did you organize your notes or whatever that you screwed up reading this so badly? This is the part you snipped from between those two lines:

serious though people vastly overestimate their ability to communicate and pick up on sarcasm through text. Speaking of:

@boom, with so much analysis I'm happy to sheep you!
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Re: Brooklyn 99 Mafia: Halloween Heist - Day 1 - A-Sashin's Creed

Postby jimbobmacdoodle » Mon Nov 12, 2018 10:23 pm UTC

BoomFrog wrote:Also, the more we discuss powers the more role info people will leak so I really think we should drop this topic, and you should probably drop the questioning of Bessie on her sash gaining mechanics.
I'm aware, I've been trying to only question people where I think there's potential for some good information gain/potential to catch people out etc. I assume you mean mpolo here too? Thank you for your response re. the dog comment. I can believe you, but I consider it NAI (scum could just as easily misremember their fake (or real) claim).

@mpolo - I misunderstood something in the rules post (just got response from a PM mod question on this), and thought I might be catching you out regarding your claim. Please ignore my question to you regarding the mechanics of your power.
Zenii wrote:i wasn't aware id be notified if my bp depleted. i wasnt the target last night

agree with bessie point now that i know that people can get the sash from being targeted ill reevaluate.

i havent had time to read the posts from this page just skimmed
Interesting okay. Thanks for clarifying.

Updated people who have said they don't have the sash currently:
Spoiler:
Jimbob
Vicarin (implied)
mpolo
Zenii
BoomFrog


Ninja'ed by BoomFrog: *facepalm* I remember reading the sarcasm comment, and somehow didn't connect it to the following point.
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Re: Brooklyn 99 Mafia: Halloween Heist - Day 2: Sashtag

Postby BoomFrog » Mon Nov 12, 2018 10:36 pm UTC

Vicarin wrote:This is mostly ok, but what about the effects of the Sash?
Now that bessie has claimed this is solved I think. People who targeted bessie know they were roleblocked by the Sash and can say the same negative answer as most others "I don't know if I was targeted by a roleblock."

Doctor will say that they don't think they were roleblocked (to say they don't know narrows down their role options too much to be a good idea).
"I don't know I was roleblocked" reveals less info then "I think I wasn't roleblocked". The latter eliminates the possibility of someone with no active power.

Vicarin wrote:In addition, if there's anyone else with abilities that aren't immediately apparent as to whether they went through or not, this plan starts falling through.

For example: say the Doctor protects someone N1, but ends up getting Jailed and targeted with the NK at the same time. Doctor will say that they don't think they were roleblocked (to say they don't know narrows down their role options too much to be a good idea). Then, is the Jailer supposed to reveal that the Doctor was blocked?
Yes. Why is this a dilema? The kill was reasonably likely to be stopped by a roleblock. In this situation we would have the bad luck that the kill was stopped by the jailers protection and not the roleblock, but it's good to narrow down the possibilities to only those two. It gives us more information. Yes, if we have a jailer that is the least helpful situation for this scheme (which is why jailer is a good role from a design side for the game because it keeps ambiguity in). We probably do have a jailer, and if we do then this scheme is going to be inconclusive. But if we have a jailer we probably don't have a doc. So a slight amendment to empower the jailer: The jailer can choose to not reveal their existence and target if they feel their target is townie. We leave it to their judgement whether they think they RBed scum or saved town and when to reveal that info. Everyone else should report honestly.
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Re: Brooklyn 99 Mafia: Halloween Heist - Day 2: Sashtag

Postby somitomi » Mon Nov 12, 2018 11:17 pm UTC

I don't have the sash.

Vicarin wrote:@somitomi: why on earth do you find mpolo and Jimbob so townie?

Jimbob's posts and his tone feels pretty consistent with what I expect of him as town. It's mostly gut feel, but for some reason I don't thin he'd fake a slip like this.
Mpolo's just in the wrong place, although I do think he's townie.

TOWN
Jimbob
LaserGuy
bessie
Mpolo
Vicarin
Boomfrog
Mark
plytho
zenii
SCUM

jimbobmacdoodle wrote:
somitomi wrote:Additionally, after rereading (again), I still find LaserGuy's case on him convincing.
Who is the "him" you are referring to here?

Plytho
jimbobmacdoodle wrote:I'm willing to buy mpolo's reasoning, but somitomi, you are aware that if you fail to vote, you are effectively giving greater control to scum for the vote. It also makes it harder to read you, so you really MUST have a vote down on somebody. Presumably you had a vague idea of who you either felt scummy or townie, in which case, you should have voted them/sheeped them respectively at the least.

Yes, I know, even random voting is better, yet I'm hesitant to vote even when I feel somewhat certain. I can't really explain this dissonance in my thought processes.

ninja'd by a lot, because I forgot to send.
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Re: Brooklyn 99 Mafia: Halloween Heist - Day 2: Sashtag

Postby somitomi » Mon Nov 12, 2018 11:20 pm UTC

I'll read my backlog tomorrow, it's past midnight now. Good night
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Re: Brooklyn 99 Mafia: Halloween Heist - Day 2: Sashtag

Postby LaserGuy » Mon Nov 12, 2018 11:52 pm UTC

I stole the sash from bessie last night. It does not appear to have resulted in my being roleblocked.

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Re: Brooklyn 99 Mafia: Halloween Heist - Day 2: Sashtag

Postby BoomFrog » Tue Nov 13, 2018 12:23 am UTC

somitomi wrote:Jimbob's posts and his tone feels pretty consistent with what I expect of him as town. It's mostly gut feel, but for some reason I don't thin he'd fake a slip like this.

What's the slip? I'm not seeing it.
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Re: Brooklyn 99 Mafia: Halloween Heist - Day 2: Sashtag

Postby Vicarin » Tue Nov 13, 2018 12:42 am UTC

Oh boy, I get around to saying explicitly that I don't have the Sash and then LaserGuy claims to have it. Amazing.

@LaserGuy: are you saying that you're pretty sure it wasn't roleblocked, but you're not certain? Also, why target bessie, given there was a decent chance of this sort of thing happening.

@BoomFrog: I would be decently surprised at someone not having an active power given the claims so far (I'm guessing mpolo would be able to tell if he got roleblocked), so I don't think the information given in those situations is that different.

For people responding, how many people do you think will say "I wasn't roleblocked" compared to "I don't know if I was roleblocked'?

@jimbob: I'd been thinking that there was a pretty good chance of the Sash being with an indie who wouldn't want to claim it, and thought that more likely than it just being with the person least likely to claim to have it D1. Actually, going to check whether moody expressed any strong opinions about the claiming, seeing what we know now...

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Re: Brooklyn 99 Mafia: Halloween Heist - Day 2: Sashtag

Postby Vicarin » Tue Nov 13, 2018 12:52 am UTC

Damn, he stopped posting too early to have an opinion on it. Bugger.

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Re: Brooklyn 99 Mafia: Halloween Heist - Day 2: Sashtag

Postby Zenii » Tue Nov 13, 2018 12:54 am UTC

BoomFrog wrote:There's at least two scum on this list:
plytho
Mark
JimBob

Madge wrote:Plytho has been sent downstairs to work on community outreach. He was Rosa Diaz, town One-Shot Vigilante.

BoomFrog wrote:Shit... I tanked this game hard. I need a reread.

Huh.

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Re: Brooklyn 99 Mafia: Halloween Heist - Day 2: Sashtag

Postby Zenii » Tue Nov 13, 2018 1:01 am UTC

sash started game with town as per the rules (pseudorandom ie randomized among town)

wouldn't make sense otherwise

#sabrarpostin

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Re: Brooklyn 99 Mafia: Halloween Heist - Day 2: Sashtag

Postby Vicarin » Tue Nov 13, 2018 1:03 am UTC

Booooooooooooo new Zen sucks, bring back D1 Zen.

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Re: Brooklyn 99 Mafia: Halloween Heist - Day 2: Sashtag

Postby BoomFrog » Tue Nov 13, 2018 1:09 am UTC

Yes, at the time I meant it might be plytho: town and other two are scum, but the reality of plytho being town is still jarring. I don't think I considered it seriously enough. Mark-JimBob is still possible but without the plytho connection I need to think about things more.
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Re: Brooklyn 99 Mafia: Halloween Heist - Day 2: Sashtag

Postby Zenii » Tue Nov 13, 2018 1:16 am UTC

Vicarin wrote:Booooooooooooo new Zen sucks, bring back D1 Zen.

votes Vic for posting two minutes after me. Why'd it take you so long, huh?

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Re: Brooklyn 99 Mafia: Halloween Heist - Day 2: Sashtag

Postby BoomFrog » Tue Nov 13, 2018 1:21 am UTC

Vicarin wrote:For people responding, how many people do you think will say "I wasn't roleblocked" compared to "I don't know if I was roleblocked'?

Alright, I can see this isn't going to work without more detail. I got a little bit of flavor that indicated my action happened. I assume that means I wasn't roleblocked. And as you said, most people probably have targetable powers.

I guess this whole thing can wait until we mass claim in a day or two. We are unlikely to have a straight up town roleblocker, so this is unlikely to be a fruitful endeavor.
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Re: Brooklyn 99 Mafia: Halloween Heist - Day 2: Sashtag

Postby Vicarin » Tue Nov 13, 2018 1:36 am UTC

Ah, I see. Yeah, I definitely wouldn't rely on the flavour from night actions if we're claiming like that.


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