Best *nix Desktop Environment/Window Manager/whatever

Please compose all posts in Emacs.

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What is the best GUI on GNU/Linux?

GNOME
86
35%
KDE
57
23%
FVWM
6
2%
XFCE
25
10%
Ion
3
1%
Window Maker
4
2%
Other
65
26%
 
Total votes: 246

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pieaholicx
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Re: Desktops and UIs

Postby pieaholicx » Mon Jan 28, 2008 9:52 pm UTC

Anpheus wrote:That's almost enough RAM to cache a page or two in Firefox.

Woah, Firefox? You crazy? That might be enough for lynx.
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Re: Desktops and UIs

Postby b.i.o » Tue Jan 29, 2008 3:43 am UTC

xyzzy wrote:
Silver2Falcon wrote:
xyzzy wrote:
Silver2Falcon wrote:Ugh. Why does every UI for Linux I've tried suck? Nothing has come even close to comparing to bbLean with bbInterface.


Tried blackbox?

I have quark running at the moment, which really is utterly awesome. It's just wonderful, the way it does things. Not quite perfect, but very good. Windowlab is also nice, and I'm a fan of Sawfish and Enlightenment.


Yes, and I find it lacking compared to bbLean, ironically enough.


Hm. Fluxbox maybe? As for something completely different, Sawfish is quite interesting, and some of the tiling managers are downright neat.


Still faaaar more limited than the bb4win variants. There are some pretty powerful and useful extensions for the windows versions of Blackbox--it's far outgrown it's Unix origins.

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Re: Best *nix Desktop Environment/Window Manager/whatever

Postby OOPMan » Thu Jan 31, 2008 7:58 am UTC

I'm surprised so many people like Gnome...
Image

Image

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Re: Best *nix Desktop Environment/Window Manager/whatever

Postby Nya » Thu Jan 31, 2008 8:09 am UTC

Image

KDE is the finest Desktop Environment that Linux has to offer right now.

I had to use GNOME for a while and I didn't like it's lack of configurability. Yup, Linus is a troll, but I still agree with most of his points regarding GNOME.
Every time I see GNOME's configuration options I understand why Ubuntu is using it as it's default WM. It's a simple user-friendly WM but it surely lacks many features that a power-user needs (From the simplest, 'Send Inputs to All Sections' Konsole option, to the greatly configuratable and feature-rich KDE's default media player, Amarok, in comparison with Rhythmbox.)

As far as the other window managers are concerned (Fluxbox, Openbox, Enlightenment, IceWM, ctwm, you name it), I find them useful only in old-hardware computers. Yeah, they can look cool, like the desktops in The Bourne Identity if you twerk them a bit, but what's the point of using a lib-independent WM when with the opening of the essential (nowadays) Firefox you will have to load libgnome? Yes, you can easily avoid Qt/GTK/Whatever dependent applications, but would that be productive?

Finally, note that talking about the "best" UI means that we have the computer specs needed to use that UI in it's full potential. If that's not the case, then I have to add that in my 128MB RAM, 777Mhz CPU laptop, I'm not running KDE (It can handle it but it would freeze a bit here and there, and that annoyed me), but XFCE. I replaced Firefox with Opera (which has less memory leaks), Amarok with mpg123 and cplay, Thunderbird with mutt, rtorrent stayed rtorrent, and blah blah blah. I also switched my source-based distro of choice to a binary-based one, to avoid burning my laptop with continuous compilations.
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Re: Best *nix Desktop Environment/Window Manager/whatever

Postby Eschatokyrios » Thu Jan 31, 2008 8:13 am UTC

I hate GNOME, it's damn clunky and looks ugly as sin. At the moment I use KDE, mostly for Amarok. I've started using a DE-less solaris system with fluxbox for my CS class, which I've grown fond of. I'm going to try to run fluxbox under KDE and see how that goes.
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Re: Best *nix Desktop Environment/Window Manager/whatever

Postby Hurduser » Thu Jan 31, 2008 8:19 am UTC

Since I am working with my craptop (P1 processor with 75 MHz, 40 MB RAM, Damn Small Linux) rather much lately, I grew partial to Fluxbox.
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Re: Best *nix Desktop Environment/Window Manager/whatever

Postby niko7865 » Thu Jan 31, 2008 8:35 am UTC

I use gnome/xfce/openbox. Mainly because they look the most elegant. I cannot stand any of the themes for KDE and I hate Amarok with a passion, why is everything KDE just so damn ugly.
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Re: Best *nix Desktop Environment/Window Manager/whatever

Postby tylerwylie » Thu Jan 31, 2008 8:48 am UTC

I'm a sucker for GNOME.
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Re: Best *nix Desktop Environment/Window Manager/whatever

Postby Nya » Thu Jan 31, 2008 9:13 am UTC

tylerwylie wrote:
niko7865 wrote:I use gnome/xfce/openbox. Mainly because they look the most elegant. I cannot stand any of the themes for KDE and I hate Amarok with a passion, why is everything KDE just so damn ugly.

KDE is for kids, it has to be. Why is everything so glossy, why are the icons so glossy, it's really annoying.


You can change them, you know that, eh? Maybe not, since you are most probably used to GNOME but ...you can change them.
Why, why, why! Because it's all logic and reason now. Science, progress, laws of hydraulics, laws of social dynamics, laws of this, that, and the other. No place for three-legged cyclops in the South Seas. No place for cucumber trees and oceans of wine.

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Re: Best *nix Desktop Environment/Window Manager/whatever

Postby tylerwylie » Thu Jan 31, 2008 9:21 am UTC

Nya wrote:
tylerwylie wrote:
niko7865 wrote:I use gnome/xfce/openbox. Mainly because they look the most elegant. I cannot stand any of the themes for KDE and I hate Amarok with a passion, why is everything KDE just so damn ugly.

KDE is for kids, it has to be. Why is everything so glossy, why are the icons so glossy, it's really annoying.


You can change them, you know that, eh? Maybe not, since you are most probably used to GNOME but ...you can change them.

Yes, but the majority of the themes you find from kde-look.org are glossy and crappy. Qtcurve is the only way you can use KDE without severe eye-damage from the gloss anyways.
Who are you and who am I
To say we know the reason why?
Some are born; some men die
Beneath one infinite sky.
There'll be war, there'll be peace.
But everything one day will cease.
All the iron turned to rust;
All the proud men turned to dust.

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Re: Best *nix Desktop Environment/Window Manager/whatever

Postby Hurduser » Thu Jan 31, 2008 11:41 am UTC

tylerwylie wrote:Yes, but the majority of the themes you find from kde-look.org are glossy and crappy. Qtcurve is the only way you can use KDE without severe eye-damage from the gloss anyways.


There are some nice non-glossy themes for KDE... it doesn't matter whether there are many themes if there is one you really like, you see? ;)
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Re: Best *nix Desktop Environment/Window Manager/whatever

Postby Dingbats » Thu Jan 31, 2008 12:10 pm UTC

The only compelling reason I use Gnome is because it's the Ubuntu default and I think it looks good. I'd really want to try out KDE though. Some time.

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Re: Best *nix Desktop Environment/Window Manager/whatever

Postby bavardage » Thu Jan 31, 2008 2:46 pm UTC

Openbox for the win?
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Re: Best *nix Desktop Environment/Window Manager/whatever

Postby b.i.o » Thu Jan 31, 2008 5:50 pm UTC

You forgot the option for 'does not exist' :?.

I have yet to find a *nix desktop environment that I can stand to use for long periods of time.


*edit*
Actually, I kind of like the look of Openbox. I may have to check that out.

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Re: Best *nix Desktop Environment/Window Manager/whatever

Postby d3adf001 » Fri Feb 01, 2008 5:33 pm UTC

hey OOPMan thanks for bringing a dead thread back.

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Re: Best *nix Desktop Environment/Window Manager/whatever

Postby Pobega » Mon Feb 04, 2008 1:07 pm UTC

There are only three environments I've adapted myself to, each of which with it's own plus-sides.

Xfce4: By default I think Xfce is ugly; But with a little bit of configuration and sizing down it becomes usable. It's very light on my system resources while still giving my laptop that polished feel. My primary reason for using this is to shut my friends up when they're on my laptop, because they can't get used to either of my other two environments.

Window Maker: My personal favorite when it comes to a window manager. Very lightweight and fast, and when combined with dockapps it practically becomes a full desktop environment. Not too pretty, but very responsive and light on resources.

GNU Screen: Not really a 'desktop' environment, but definitely a work environment, GNU Screen is my favorite out of the three. I can get everything done in Screen without the X11 overhead and wasted resources.

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Re: Best *nix Desktop Environment/Window Manager/whatever

Postby Einarin » Tue Feb 12, 2008 4:10 am UTC

I oscillate between E17 and Gnome. I really like Enlightenment but it's still short enough features that I get annoyed. Truthfully, though I run Gnome because I'm pretty much a total Compiz whore. I really wish I could have E17's ui with compositing crazyness, but its not possible, so I make do with my heavily customized Gnome. Basically, with my custom gtk theme, avant-window-navigator (an OSX like dock), Exaile, Firefox, and a background changer script, I make it my own.

KDE4 is showing a lot of promise, but for now its just promise. I will go on record as saying I hate Konqueror as a filemanager, but my biggest complaint about KDE is just that it feels too much like Windows.

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Re: Best *nix Desktop Environment/Window Manager/whatever

Postby ash.gti » Tue Feb 12, 2008 10:05 pm UTC

Hey now, where is Aqua GUI?

OS X is 100% Unix compliant :-P and you only said *nix

Don't hate man!

**edit, woops, i don't know why i put darwin as the GUI, thats not a GUI. Aqua GUI is the GUI of OS X
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Re: Best *nix Desktop Environment/Window Manager/whatever

Postby Endless Mike » Tue Feb 12, 2008 10:17 pm UTC

Isn't Aqua the "theme" and Quartz (Extreme) the WM/DE?

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Re: Best *nix Desktop Environment/Window Manager/whatever

Postby ash.gti » Tue Feb 12, 2008 10:21 pm UTC

Eh... um... I duno about that.

Thats just the rendering engine.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aqua_%28user_interface%29
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Re: Best *nix Desktop Environment/Window Manager/whatever

Postby AndyG314 » Wed Feb 13, 2008 9:21 pm UTC

I gotta go with Fluxbox
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Re: Best *nix Desktop Environment/Window Manager/whatever

Postby coppro » Fri Feb 15, 2008 6:17 am UTC

Einarin wrote:KDE4 is showing a lot of promise, but for now its just promise. I will go on record as saying I hate Konqueror as a filemanager, but my biggest complaint about KDE is just that it feels too much like Windows.

I see KDE4 as being a little sparse right now, and it doesn't work right on my computer (probably I'm doing something wrong).

But I personally, I never, ever use a graphical file manager when I can avoid it... I just have CTRL-ALT-T bring up a terminal and go wild... it's significantly faster. And if you want a 'back' button, just spawn a sub-shell.

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Re: Best *nix Desktop Environment/Window Manager/whatever

Postby EvanED » Fri Feb 15, 2008 6:27 am UTC

coppro wrote:
Einarin wrote:KDE4 is showing a lot of promise, but for now its just promise. I will go on record as saying I hate Konqueror as a filemanager, but my biggest complaint about KDE is just that it feels too much like Windows.

I see KDE4 as being a little sparse right now, and it doesn't work right on my computer (probably I'm doing something wrong).

But I personally, I never, ever use a graphical file manager when I can avoid it... I just have CTRL-ALT-T bring up a terminal and go wild... it's significantly faster. And if you want a 'back' button, just spawn a sub-shell.

pushd? Even Windows' command interpreter has that. Heck, when I was using zsh I set up autopushd or whatever it is that makes cd look like pushd. I think bash has the same option, but I'm not sure.

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Re: Best *nix Desktop Environment/Window Manager/whatever

Postby LauraSakura » Fri Feb 22, 2008 3:23 pm UTC

I like GNOME (once I pretty it up at least). It just seems much more convenient to me. XFCE is OK too, but not my preference. I'll try out KDE4 eventually, but for now GNOME is good for me :)

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Re: Best *nix Desktop Environment/Window Manager/whatever

Postby coppro » Sun Feb 24, 2008 4:37 am UTC

EvanED wrote:
coppro wrote:But I personally, I never, ever use a graphical file manager when I can avoid it... I just have CTRL-ALT-T bring up a terminal and go wild... it's significantly faster. And if you want a 'back' button, just spawn a sub-shell.

pushd? Even Windows' command interpreter has that. Heck, when I was using zsh I set up autopushd or whatever it is that makes cd look like pushd. I think bash has the same option, but I'm not sure.
Ah, but does it save variables and history for when you pushd?

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Re: Best *nix Desktop Environment/Window Manager/whatever

Postby EvanED » Sun Feb 24, 2008 10:12 am UTC

I don't understand your question.

Are you asking if, when you popd, any environment variable changes you've made are undone? If so, the answer is "no, but I think that's a feature rather than a bug."

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Re: Best *nix Desktop Environment/Window Manager/whatever

Postby danielbeaver » Mon Feb 25, 2008 6:58 pm UTC

I have tried the Windows, OSX, KDE, gnome, and Xfce environments. I have also tried the bblean (for windows), fluxbox, ion3, icewm, window maker, and enlightenment window managers. I think it is worth distinguishing between window managers and desktop environments. A desktop environment is an UI plus a suite of applications; a window manager is just a UI, nothing else.

My favorite window manager is ion. I think that the tiling/tab/multidesktop paradigm is the best window management paradigm. The only downside is lack of support for applications that use the gnome tray. But there are KDE and xfce equivalents that work. My favorite window manager with floating windows is Enlightenment... sort of. I think the default Enlightenment setup is crap, but I have seen some distros do amazing things with it.

My favorite linux desktop environment is gnome with compiz fusion (metacity can burn in hell). I find it to be deceptively elegant an functional. Xfce is very close to surpassing gnome. KDE3's UI is a mess, but it has a lot of functionality (I am very curious to see KDE4).

This is off-topic, but my favorite desktop environment of them all is.... Windows Vista. Seriously. It is a fast, elegant, well thought out environment, and nothing comes close to matching the vast library of software (a huge advantage). Behavior such as tiling and multiple desktops is easily added on with third party programs (though this functionality ought to exist in the WM). There are many shell replacements if you don't like the default one. Nothing is missing.

OS X is an excellent too. I love the applications that come with the OS, and the software selection is mostly complete (MS office and Matlab? Sweet! No Pro/E? :( ). The only thing that turns me off is the freaking UI. Dear god I HATE the OS X UI. It's a combination of the bizarre mouse acceleration, resizing from only one corner, lack of window tiling (don't you dare say the word "Exposé" or I will gouge your eyes out), lack of image preview, Miller Columns in Finder, etc, etc. ad infinitum. The whole UI makes me irrationally angry whenever I think about it. However, most people I talk to love the UI, so I wouldn't hesitate to recommend OS X.

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Re: Best *nix Desktop Environment/Window Manager/whatever

Postby zenten » Tue Feb 26, 2008 12:59 pm UTC

I have to admit I kind of like the default Vista UI as well. It's buggy as all hell though. That windows defender thing or whatever it's called is ass though, and I can't seem to be able to turn it off on my wife's box.

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Re: Best *nix Desktop Environment/Window Manager/whatever

Postby danielbeaver » Tue Feb 26, 2008 6:07 pm UTC

zenten wrote:That windows defender thing or whatever it's called is ass though, and I can't seem to be able to turn it off on my wife's box.

Here ya go. It has its uses; I usually recommend that people keep it on. I myself am one of those crazy people who doesn't run an antivirus program.

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Re: Best *nix Desktop Environment/Window Manager/whatever

Postby ash.gti » Tue Feb 26, 2008 6:37 pm UTC

danielbeaver wrote:
zenten wrote:That windows defender thing or whatever it's called is ass though, and I can't seem to be able to turn it off on my wife's box.

Here ya go. It has its uses; I usually recommend that people keep it on. I myself am one of those crazy people who doesn't run an antivirus program.


I never did when I ran windows, never had a problem with virus's though. I am... kinda weird in that respect. Almost once a week I go through the list of processes running on my computer and go "Hey! Who told you to start!" then kill it and figure out where it came from, then proceed to make sure it never starts unless I tell it to. I am very particular about what is running on my computer.

I did it on windows, linux and I still do it on OS X. But its a lot easier to do on OS X and Unix thats for sure :-P
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Re: Best *nix Desktop Environment/Window Manager/whatever

Postby wubrgamer » Tue Feb 26, 2008 6:38 pm UTC

Gnome, ONLY BECAUSE IT HAS THE SUPPORT.


All of the distros have turned their focus towards it. (Fedora, RHEL, Ubuntu, SUSE[yes, even SUSE] have all been focusing on GNOME) Thus making it the most full featured and usable.

That being said, I wish more would be done with XFCE...it's got some great potential to be a pretty/stable/mc-awesome DE, but it just doesn't have the focus, even the most mature distro (which I won't bother to name) has a buggy XFCE version of their DE for their distro...

Aack, Why can't we all just get along and work on some standards so it doesn't matter anymore (*cough* LSB *cough* freedesktop.org */cough*)
Last edited by Hammer on Tue Feb 26, 2008 7:07 pm UTC, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Best *nix Desktop Environment/Window Manager/whatever

Postby d3adf001 » Tue Feb 26, 2008 7:01 pm UTC

wubrgamer wrote:[center]Gnome, ONLY BECAUSE IT HAS THE SUPPORT.


This is news to me. last time i checked kde has support too. both help wise and distro wise. FC has kde, arch, gentoo, and slackware (slack dropped gnome because it sucked too much) ther eare probably more but thats what i can think atm.

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Re: Best *nix Desktop Environment/Window Manager/whatever

Postby wubrgamer » Tue Feb 26, 2008 9:05 pm UTC

Sorry, I meant that it is the MOST supported IMHO, I think it's being the most actively worked on.

That being said, KDE4 is going to kick some serious computing behind and might make me change my mind...although...it doesn't seem to be in the main installs yet.

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Re: Best *nix Desktop Environment/Window Manager/whatever

Postby taylor_venable » Wed Feb 27, 2008 10:59 am UTC

For a window manager I prefer FVWM. On my laptop I use GNOME running not that crappy metacity (for which the shortcut keys I set for locking the screen don't even work), but FVWM as the window manager. True, it kind of pisses GNOME off, but with some twerking you can get it to work pretty well. On my desktop it's just straight FVWM - and my desktop environment there is GNU Emacs. :)
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Re: Best *nix Desktop Environment/Window Manager/whatever

Postby d3adf001 » Thu Feb 28, 2008 1:02 am UTC

wubrgamer wrote:Sorry, I meant that it is the MOST supported IMHO, I think it's being the most actively worked on.

That being said, KDE4 is going to kick some serious computing behind and might make me change my mind...although...it doesn't seem to be in the main installs yet.



wait till 4.1 its not really ready atm. once its ready its going to kick ass

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Re: Best *nix Desktop Environment/Window Manager/whatever

Postby Noughmad » Fri Feb 29, 2008 9:29 pm UTC

d3adf001 wrote:
wubrgamer wrote:Sorry, I meant that it is the MOST supported IMHO, I think it's being the most actively worked on.

That being said, KDE4 is going to kick some serious computing behind and might make me change my mind...although...it doesn't seem to be in the main installs yet.



wait till 4.1 its not really ready atm. once its ready its going to kick ass
4.01 was already a great improvement over 4.0. However, there are still many things to be done.

Also, KOffice 2 is said to be awesome when it comes out. I haven't even tried it yet (it's in alpha), I've just heard good things about it.
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Re: Best *nix Desktop Environment/Window Manager/whatever

Postby zenten » Sat Mar 22, 2008 12:03 am UTC

Ok, I've seen the light, and I now wish I could change my poll vote to ratpoison (of course that would be "other", as the one that made this poll is a heathen).

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Re: Best *nix Desktop Environment/Window Manager/whatever

Postby skilaatara » Tue Mar 25, 2008 7:02 pm UTC

Perhaps it's wrong of me to vote on a "best" when I've never even heard of FVWM, XFCE, or Window Maker before, but on the other hand, this is a religious wars forum, and I don't need to attend CCD to burn papists...

That being said, I like Ion3. I like Ion3 and I particularly despise Gnome -- mostly because as the Ubuntu default, Other People have used its menus to fuck with my computer's settings to confusing and displeasing results. I can't think offhand of anything I'd want in a windowing manager for a personal machine that Ion doesn't match. Tiling makes so much sense, keyboard controls are efficient, and generally using a CLI is very grounding (for contrast, see: Gnome menus, People fucking with).

I wouldn't advise Ion for a public terminal, though. It's lovely when customized, but I don't remember the default key combos except so far as remembering that I don't want to. For something a little more regularized, Aqua is pleasant.

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Re: Best *nix Desktop Environment/Window Manager/whatever

Postby Mr. Heavy » Wed Mar 26, 2008 12:36 pm UTC

KDE 3 is the winner, though KDE 4.1 may give it a run for its money.

GNOME's insistence on doing basically every single possible thing in C is why every one of their applications look like they came from 1991 with an updated skin.

d3adf001 wrote:slackware (slack dropped gnome because it sucked too much) ther eare probably more but thats what i can think atm.

Yeah this is kind of ironic actually considering how Slackware is basically the most ill-conceived, lacking-vision distro around these days

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Re: Best *nix Desktop Environment/Window Manager/whatever

Postby xyzzy » Wed Mar 26, 2008 7:54 pm UTC

I like my apps to look like they came from 1991 with an updated skin. Generally, those apps are also lighter weight and less bloated. Although that doesn't apply to Gnome, unfortunately.

As far as the heavy shiny ones go, I haven't yet found something that can beat E17 on that front.
"Wile E. Coyote was a theoretical mathematician." - Leliel
"Modern life can be so boring without elements of the bizarre or the fantastical. Hence, we have steampunk." - Me


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