Mass Effect 2.

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EmptySet
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Re: Mass Effect 2 is too hard to type. ME2

Postby EmptySet » Wed Jun 09, 2010 1:51 am UTC

SlyReaper wrote:
Chfan wrote:
Spoiler:
So, Jack is disloyal, and there's no way for me to change that before the mission. Every time I do the mission, she dies. Is there anything I can do so that she won't?

Spoiler:
Yes. You can take her side instead of Miranda's in their little argument. That way, Miranda becomes disloyal instead, and dies in Jack's place. I have not found any way to get either of the paragon or renegade conversation options available in that scene, so one of them is always doomed no matter what I do.


Spoiler:
It's actually possible to get them both to live even if one isn't loyal - I had disloyal Zaeed and Miranda, and managed to get through without anyone dying. You just have to choose your people the right way for each section. Also, some people tend to die easier than others - I think Jack is pretty squishy, since she's a biotic specialist and has no defensive skills whatsoever, so it might be easier to get through with disloyal Miranda.

Anyway. What you want to do is:

1. Send a loyal tech specialist to do the tech thing at the start. That means Tali or Legion. NOT Mordin, he's a biologist.
2. Team leaders! You want soldierly types with leadership skills, who are loyal. That means Jacob, Garrus or Miranda (if she's loyal). Not Grunt or Zaeed, they're too erratic. You can just use the same ones again the second time.
3. Biotic shield. Use a biotic specialist who is loyal. Not Jacob, he's not a true specialist. If Jack's not loyal, take the asari.
4. Escorting the captives. I don't think it matters who you send as long as they are loyal. I recommend Mordin, because the next bit is...
5. Hold the line / assault the reaper. Okay, so you will take two people with you, and leave the others to hold the line. The two you take with you should be loyal, and you want to take those who have no defensive powers and/or low health, bad weapons (SMGs, Shotguns), or are tech or biotic specialists. I believe the most fragile are Mordin, Tali, Jack (don't take her if she's not loyal, though), and possibly Thane. Samara can use an assault rifle, and Legion has the Geth shielding power and sniper rifles, so they're probably not too fragile despite being specialists. You want to leave your toughest people behind so they can save the team while your disloyal members cower behind a crate. The toughest are the soldiers and team leaders - Zaeed, Grunt, Garrus (hey, he did hold off all those mercs by himself), Jacob, and Loyal Miranda. Make sure you leave them there.
6. Fight the reaper. Hope nobody dies.


Also, I agree that the Paragon/Renegade system is irritating. I had like 90% paragon and 20% Renegade, and I couldn't convince Zaeed not to throw a hissy fit. Then, due to being Paragon on Zaeed's loyalty mission and doing a few other things, I was at about 97% Paragon by the time I got to Miranda's mission, and still couldn't solve the argument. After finishing the game and getting even more Paragon points, I still can't stop her sulking despite the fact that the Paragon meter looks like it's maxed out. It seems like the only way to actually convince people of anything is to painstakingly take the Paragon option every time and never the Renegade option (even when there is no Paragon option), or vice versa, rather than actually thinking "What would my character do in this situation?"

You, sir, name? wrote:Male Shepard has, in some scenes a most annoying facial expression, the Clark-Kent-in-earlier-Smallville-episodes-"but-that's-wrong!"-face. It really bugs me.


Can't say I really noticed that. Maybe it's a thing with your Shepard's face. Then again, it might just be personal tastes. I've seen several people saying that Female Shepard's voice acting is like the best EVAR, while Male Shep's is monotonous. Personally, I think Fem Shep's drawl makes it sound like she's either just been shaken out of bed with a hangover, or is about to fall asleep from boredom. Male Shep sounds fine, if somewhat generic.

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Re: Mass Effect 2 is too hard to type. ME2

Postby You, sir, name? » Wed Jun 09, 2010 2:15 am UTC

I'm using stock Shepard. But I don't know. I'll try get a screencap of it tomorrow if I remember.
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Re: Mass Effect 2 is too hard to type. ME2

Postby thecommabandit » Wed Jun 09, 2010 8:46 am UTC

EmptySet wrote:
You, sir, name? wrote:Male Shepard has, in some scenes a most annoying facial expression, the Clark-Kent-in-earlier-Smallville-episodes-"but-that's-wrong!"-face. It really bugs me.


Can't say I really noticed that. Maybe it's a thing with your Shepard's face. Then again, it might just be personal tastes. I've seen several people saying that Female Shepard's voice acting is like the best EVAR, while Male Shep's is monotonous. Personally, I think Fem Shep's drawl makes it sound like she's either just been shaken out of bed with a hangover, or is about to fall asleep from boredom. Male Shep sounds fine, if somewhat generic.

Finally, someone with sense. Hale did a much better job than Meer in the first game, but in this one Hale just got monotonous and husky. And Meer improved enough that he was actually better than Hale. The only bit that made me cringe was when he says "I've had enough of this colony" at the end of Horizon. The way he says 'colony' just sounds weak and upset, totally at odds with the frustrated tone of the rest of the sentence.

Shepard's default facial expression is highly reliant upon his actual face; if you can make it right you can get him looking as if he's about to go "SON, I AM DISAPPOINT" while doing the nasty with Jack. Half the struggle of the face maker is getting a neutral expression. That's of course assuming you're taking it seriously. I've seen a large number of YouTube videos with a Shepard with a humongous brick of a face, skin that's nearly red and a handlebar moustache looking like he's restraining himself from murdering everyone he sees.
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Re: Mass Effect 2 is too hard to type. ME2

Postby SlyReaper » Wed Jun 09, 2010 11:53 am UTC

thecommabandit wrote:
EmptySet wrote:
You, sir, name? wrote:Male Shepard has, in some scenes a most annoying facial expression, the Clark-Kent-in-earlier-Smallville-episodes-"but-that's-wrong!"-face. It really bugs me.


Can't say I really noticed that. Maybe it's a thing with your Shepard's face. Then again, it might just be personal tastes. I've seen several people saying that Female Shepard's voice acting is like the best EVAR, while Male Shep's is monotonous. Personally, I think Fem Shep's drawl makes it sound like she's either just been shaken out of bed with a hangover, or is about to fall asleep from boredom. Male Shep sounds fine, if somewhat generic.

Finally, someone with sense. Hale did a much better job than Meer in the first game, but in this one Hale just got monotonous and husky. And Meer improved enough that he was actually better than Hale. The only bit that made me cringe was when he says "I've had enough of this colony" at the end of Horizon. The way he says 'colony' just sounds weak and upset, totally at odds with the frustrated tone of the rest of the sentence.

Shepard's default facial expression is highly reliant upon his actual face; if you can make it right you can get him looking as if he's about to go "SON, I AM DISAPPOINT" while doing the nasty with Jack. Half the struggle of the face maker is getting a neutral expression. That's of course assuming you're taking it seriously. I've seen a large number of YouTube videos with a Shepard with a humongous brick of a face, skin that's nearly red and a handlebar moustache looking like he's restraining himself from murdering everyone he sees.


Google "the adventures of ugly shepherd".
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Re: Mass Effect 2 is too hard to type. ME2

Postby ProZac » Wed Jun 09, 2010 12:44 pm UTC

SlyReaper wrote:
Chfan wrote:
Spoiler:
So, Jack is disloyal, and there's no way for me to change that before the mission. Every time I do the mission, she dies. Is there anything I can do so that she won't?

Spoiler:
Yes. You can take her side instead of Miranda's in their little argument. That way, Miranda becomes disloyal instead, and dies in Jack's place. I have not found any way to get either of the paragon or renegade conversation options available in that scene, so one of them is always doomed no matter what I do.

Spoiler:
I, to this day, do not know what argument this is, but hear about it all the time. I guess I was just high enough renegade by then to stomp it out before it became a problem. I did come into the problem with Tali/Legion argument though, and I wasn't Renegade/Paragon enough to solve it, which kinda annoyed me.

EmptySet wrote:It seems like the only way to actually convince people of anything is to painstakingly take the Paragon option every time and never the Renegade option (even when there is no Paragon option), or vice versa, rather than actually thinking "What would my character do in this situation?"

This also bothered the hell out of me. I ended at like 25% Paragon, 85% Renegade. There were a few key points where I was just annoyed I couldn't take either the Paragon or Renegade option. My Shepard has to be "Uber Nice Sensitive Guy" or "Complete and Total Jackass" to determine how he reacts to what people say?

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Re: Mass Effect 2 is too hard to type. ME2

Postby Vaniver » Wed Jun 09, 2010 2:38 pm UTC

ProZac wrote:My Shepard has to be "Uber Nice Sensitive Guy" or "Complete and Total Jackass" to determine how he reacts to what people say?
Welcome to BioWare games. :P
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Re: Mass Effect 2 is too hard to type. ME2

Postby Vyn » Wed Jun 09, 2010 3:35 pm UTC

I'm still not sure how people have so much trouble with
Spoiler:
Tali/Legion and Miranda/Jack's argument. I've played through 7 times now with every class, male and female Shep, and on every difficulty but casual and hard. Yet I've never once lost a single person on the mission or had the Paragon/Renegade option (depending on which I was) greyed out when I did those arguments. And it's not like I click every single Renegade or every single Paragon option either. In every Paragon game I still choose the Renegade option on Thane's loyalty missions to beat the crap out of Kelham and I still choose most of the Renegade options on Omega during Mordin's recruitment. Though in my Renegade games I still pick certain Paragon options like not killing the 3 Batarians on Mordin's recruitment or always rewriting the heretics on Legions loyalty mission. Every game I finish with 100% either Paragon or Renegade and about 20-30% of the other. The only way I can imagine not getting that is if you don't put any points in your passive class talent... which is retarded. Always one of the first thigns I max, and always the one that gives 100% bonus to P/R. Later in the game after I've maxed the one bar, I normally respec and get the damage boosting +70% P/R one and it'll still be maxed before the suicide mission easily. I'm playing a Renegade Adept on Insanity right now, just got past the Collector ship with my new assault rifle training and have like 8 loyalty missions to do plus the Reaper IFF and I'm at about 90% Renegade already with the Nemesis talent (70% P/R). And I've also got 20% Paragon... I can't figure out how you can't get to 100% easily before you even do the 4 loyalty missions that trigger the arguments.
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Re: Mass Effect 2 is too hard to type. ME2

Postby ProZac » Wed Jun 09, 2010 4:59 pm UTC

Vaniver wrote:
ProZac wrote:My Shepard has to be "Uber Nice Sensitive Guy" or "Complete and Total Jackass" to determine how he reacts to what people say?
Welcome to BioWare games. :P

And part of the reason I generally don't play them :P (Only ever played Mass Effects and Baldur's Gate II. I hate morality systems).
Vyn wrote:I'm still not sure how people have so much trouble with
Spoiler:
Tali/Legion and Miranda/Jack's argument. I've played through 7 times now with every class, male and female Shep, and on every difficulty but casual and hard. Yet I've never once lost a single person on the mission or had the Paragon/Renegade option (depending on which I was) greyed out when I did those arguments. And it's not like I click every single Renegade or every single Paragon option either. In every Paragon game I still choose the Renegade option on Thane's loyalty missions to beat the crap out of Kelham and I still choose most of the Renegade options on Omega during Mordin's recruitment. Though in my Renegade games I still pick certain Paragon options like not killing the 3 Batarians on Mordin's recruitment or always rewriting the heretics on Legions loyalty mission. Every game I finish with 100% either Paragon or Renegade and about 20-30% of the other. The only way I can imagine not getting that is if you don't put any points in your passive class talent... which is retarded. Always one of the first thigns I max, and always the one that gives 100% bonus to P/R. Later in the game after I've maxed the one bar, I normally respec and get the damage boosting +70% P/R one and it'll still be maxed before the suicide mission easily. I'm playing a Renegade Adept on Insanity right now, just got past the Collector ship with my new assault rifle training and have like 8 loyalty missions to do plus the Reaper IFF and I'm at about 90% Renegade already with the Nemesis talent (70% P/R). And I've also got 20% Paragon... I can't figure out how you can't get to 100% easily before you even do the 4 loyalty missions that trigger the arguments.

Spoiler:
That talent was the first thing I maxed out. I would attribute it to maybe a couple of things in my case. First, every time you can't do a renegade/paragon option, you lose potential points. Example, I did Jacob's loyalty mission as one of my last. It has low requirement on points to access all options there (I think). I did Samara's as one of my early ones. I lost on potential points for not being able to fully resist her daughter. Also, I didn't always take the renegade or paragon option. Sometimes I'd take the nuetral option, and get no points. Not neccessarily a good idea game wise, but I wanted to respond how I want, not in a way so that "I can have full options later".

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Re: Mass Effect 2 is too hard to type. ME2

Postby Vyn » Wed Jun 09, 2010 6:54 pm UTC

Spoiler:
Well, starting a game from ME1 save with a high Paragon/Renegade score also nets you starting points (up to 190 if you had max) and that boost is HUGE because of the fact that it enables pretty much all respective options for all of the first recruitment missions until the Horizon mission on its own, not counting all the points you get during said recruitment missions. It makes it very hard to fall behind and allows you to choose a great deal of what you want vs. all of one just to unlock others. Other little things like always going for the discounts in stores for the points as well help quite a bit.
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Re: Mass Effect 2 is too hard to type. ME2

Postby Chfan » Wed Jun 09, 2010 8:55 pm UTC

Spoiler:
I can't go back and make Jack loyal, and if I leave her to hold the line she dies. Would sending her to escort the crew work?
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Re: Mass Effect 2 is too hard to type. ME2

Postby thecommabandit » Wed Jun 09, 2010 9:48 pm UTC

Chfan wrote:
Spoiler:
I can't go back and make Jack loyal, and if I leave her to hold the line she dies. Would sending her to escort the crew work?

Spoiler:
Possibly. From what I hear Mordin is the squishiest, so if left to hold the line he often dies so it's usually advisable to send him to escort the crew. But if Mordin is loyal then he might not die. You can always reload the save, right?
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Re: Mass Effect 2 is too hard to type. ME2

Postby You, sir, name? » Wed Jun 09, 2010 10:21 pm UTC

Seems really arbitrary what gives you renegade score. Apparently, you're a renegade if you uphold military protocol aboard the Normandy o_O. Also, sniping a hostile android is another renegade action during the Archangel mission.
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Re: Mass Effect 2 is too hard to type. ME2

Postby EmptySet » Thu Jun 10, 2010 1:44 am UTC

thecommabandit wrote:
Chfan wrote:
Spoiler:
I can't go back and make Jack loyal, and if I leave her to hold the line she dies. Would sending her to escort the crew work?

Spoiler:
Possibly. From what I hear Mordin is the squishiest, so if left to hold the line he often dies so it's usually advisable to send him to escort the crew. But if Mordin is loyal then he might not die. You can always reload the save, right?


Spoiler:
I'm pretty sure Bad Stuff happens if you send a non-loyal person with the crew - though I'm not certain whether it's your team member dying, or most of the crew, or possibly both. If Mordin is loyal he should do better holding the line than Jack, though - I think Jack is the next most squishy, and being loyal is supposed to give you a fairly substantial boost.

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Re: Mass Effect 2 is too hard to type. ME2

Postby EdgarJPublius » Thu Jun 10, 2010 2:58 am UTC

This walkthrough on the Mass Effect Wiki has a very thorough breakdown of
Spoiler:
who could die at what part of the final mission.
Caution, massive spoilers for the end of the game:


http://masseffect.wikia.com/wiki/Mass_E ... de_Mission
Reading this pissed me off 'cause I sent a loyal Thane through the tubes to open the door, figuring that his sneaking around in small places experience would be ideal, but apparently I needed someone with better door closing ability :/
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Re: Mass Effect 2 is too hard to type. ME2

Postby Gopher of Pern » Thu Jun 10, 2010 3:22 am UTC

EdgarJPublius wrote:This walkthrough on the Mass Effect Wiki has a very thorough breakdown of
Spoiler:
who could die at what part of the final mission.
Caution, massive spoilers for the end of the game:


http://masseffect.wikia.com/wiki/Mass_E ... de_Mission
Reading this pissed me off 'cause I sent a loyal Thane through the tubes to open the door, figuring that his sneaking around in small places experience would be ideal, but apparently I needed someone with better door closing ability :/


Spoiler:
Yeah, I had the same problem, but with Garrus. You would think Garrus would be a good enough specialist to open the door, as well as tough enough to survive on his own for awhile, but no...
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Re: Mass Effect 2 is too hard to type. ME2

Postby ProZac » Thu Jun 10, 2010 12:58 pm UTC

You, sir, name? wrote:Seems really arbitrary what gives you renegade score. Apparently, you're a renegade if you uphold military protocol aboard the Normandy o_O. Also, sniping a hostile android is another renegade action during the Archangel mission.

But of course. It's not good/evil or right/wrong. It's sensitive-guy/jackass.

Also, on the ending mission:
Spoiler:
I didn't have anyone die my first run through (with only Tali not loyal). I thought they made it pretty clear it needs to be a Tech specialist in the tube. The only unclear ones are really the escort and team leaders. Maybe it was just easy for me since I had nearly everyone loyal.

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Re: Mass Effect 2 is too hard to type. ME2

Postby Chen » Thu Jun 10, 2010 1:25 pm UTC

Spoiler:
Yeah I sent the Justicar as a team leader and ended up losing someone in that fight. I mean the characters even agreed with me that sending her as the team leader seemed right. It was pretty arbitrary what worked in that case I think

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Re: Mass Effect 2 is too hard to type. ME2

Postby LTK » Thu Jun 10, 2010 8:50 pm UTC

Spoiler:
Well, it takes some thinking through but you can reasonably determine who is the most suited for a particular task. You can pick Garrus as a team leader if you remember how he led a merc band on Omega, but Samara or Thane are poor choices because they have always worked on their own. Samara, however, is suitable as a biotic specialist, as is Jack because they're both known to be extremely powerful biotics, and even though Thane is a biotic, that doesn't play a major role in his character, so that makes him unsuitable too.


So I did every mission and assignment available, as well as the endgame, tried to do Zaeed's mission for the umpteenth time, and even did the Paragon interrupt at the start, and I still can't convince him! So this time I left him there to die. Probably won't stick with that, though, so hopefully it doesn't matter whether or not a party member is loyal for ME3. Seeing as he's a DLC character, probably not.

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Re: Mass Effect 2 is too hard to type. ME2

Postby Vyn » Fri Jun 11, 2010 1:38 pm UTC

Strange LTK... I did full Paragon choices for Zaeed's quest on the third time I did it just to see it and he still ended up loyal at the end of it. Confusing, but I wasn't complaining.
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Re: Mass Effect 2 is too hard to type. ME2

Postby mosc » Fri Jun 11, 2010 4:29 pm UTC

Zaheed has a check you can make with EXTREMELY high paragon which will make him loyal no matter what. If you fail that check, he will not unlock or be loyal no matter what.
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Re: Mass Effect 2 is too hard to type. ME2

Postby Gelsamel » Fri Jun 11, 2010 4:34 pm UTC

It might be because I imported a full paragon character from ME1... but I never ever ever had any problems doing Paragon conversation options or interupts. There was not a single one I could not do or that was not successful etc. Not sure if it's solely based on Paragon or if I did something differently but... yeah, I've never experienced any of this trouble people keep talkin' about.
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Re: Mass Effect 2 is too hard to type. ME2

Postby LTK » Fri Jun 11, 2010 6:40 pm UTC

My Paragon bar is full. Fuller than full, having that Death Mask on my head as well. Like I said before, in the most important dialogue checks it's the ratio that matters. I now have slightly more than a two-to-one ratio for Paragon/Renegade, Paragon being full and Renegade being slightly over half. So whatever I do, it's impossible to get Zaeed loyal now when taking the Paragon route.

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Re: Mass Effect 2 is too hard to type. ME2

Postby Gelsamel » Fri Jun 11, 2010 7:40 pm UTC

So doing repeat play throughs and taking different options makes you worse at conversation? I doubt that.
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Re: Mass Effect 2 is too hard to type. ME2

Postby EmptySet » Sat Jun 12, 2010 1:25 am UTC

I believe your Paragon / Renegade score gets reset when you start a new playthrough with the same character. However, doing anything other than mindlessly selecting either Paragon or Renegade every single time makes you worse at conversation (including selecting the neutral response). And I don't think it's the ratio between Paragon and Renegade options which matters, so much as the ratio of Paragon points gained to Paragon points missed (or Renegade, of course). Obviously in most situations it's Paragon OR Renegade, so choosing one does tend to ding your score for other, but there are a few choices (especially interrupts) where there's only a neutral option and one of the extremes.

Also, importing a character who already has a substantial bonus to Paragon is supposed to make it much easier - having a high score initially makes more of the persuasion options available early on, which you then get more points for using (where if you didn't have the required score, you would be further penalised for missing the points). If you start with a new character, it's extremely difficult to get many of those options - with my first character I chose Paragon about 90% of the time, with the occasional neutral, and still couldn't get most of the persuasion options I ran into early on. It's kind of a slippery slope.

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Re: Mass Effect 2 is too hard to type. ME2

Postby mosc » Mon Jun 14, 2010 7:07 pm UTC

Yeah, particularly the loyalty squabbles between jack/miranda (easier renegade) and legion/tali (easier paragon). If you are trying to get those and don't import a character to give you a head start, you have to be pretty friggin one dimensional and do your quests in a very specific order to even have a SHOT at those options.
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Re: Mass Effect 2 is too hard to type. ME2

Postby ArgonV » Mon Jun 21, 2010 5:54 pm UTC

I just realised how much the Collectors (and especially the Collector General) look like Pilot from Farscape.

And I'm pretty sure dark matter will play a part in ME3, since it's referenced casually a few times in ME2.

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Re: Mass Effect 2 is too hard to type. ME2

Postby Vaniver » Mon Jun 21, 2010 7:46 pm UTC

So, I bought this when it went on sale on Steam, and I am enjoying it immensely. Everything seems streamlined; there are more NPCs, but it's also more intimate; the plot encourages running around and doing side things rather than encouraging you to race to the finish and never making it clear when it's opened up; the annoying "check every corner of everywhere!" quests are gone. Mordin is my new favorite NPC, I think.

It bothers me to pass up on renegade combat options, though- the cutscene will longingly show you a gas tank you can blow up, or a crate you can drop, and I sit there thinking "I only want Paragon points I only want Paragon points." It bothers me somewhat to be forced to keep telling off the Illusive Man (particularly since it's a foregone conclusion you'll agree with him), but oh well.
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Re: Mass Effect 2 is too hard to type. ME2

Postby ArgonV » Mon Jun 21, 2010 10:13 pm UTC

Why do you only want Paragon points? It's not like Renegade points detract from them? If you think blowing up gas tanks or doing other bad-ass things is cool, then do it!

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Re: Mass Effect 2 is too hard to type. ME2

Postby Xanthir » Mon Jun 21, 2010 11:34 pm UTC

The way it's been explained earlier in the thread is that, for things like the loyalty missions, what's important is your ratio of paragon/renegade points over total possible paragon/renegade points you could have earned up to that point.

So it *sounds* like, yeah, doing actions that just happen to net you renegade points is fine. The problem comes when you want to do something renegade that can *also* be done paragon, because then choosing renegade lowers your paragon ratio.
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Re: Mass Effect 2 is too hard to type. ME2

Postby thecommabandit » Tue Jun 22, 2010 8:34 am UTC

There's also the fact that even if you ignore the interrupts, you can get some interesting dialogue afterwards.
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Re: Mass Effect 2 is too hard to type. ME2

Postby ArgonV » Tue Jun 22, 2010 8:28 pm UTC

I still feel bad for
Spoiler:
The Collector-General after Harbinger leaves him. He looks so scared

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Re: Mass Effect 2 is too hard to type. ME2

Postby EdgarJPublius » Tue Jun 22, 2010 11:20 pm UTC

ArgonV wrote:I still feel bad for
Spoiler:
The Collector-General after Harbinger leaves him. He looks so scared


This is relevant

and hilarious.

so clicky click
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Re: Mass Effect 2 is too hard to type. ME2

Postby thecommabandit » Wed Jun 23, 2010 10:03 am UTC

ArgonV wrote:I still feel bad for
Spoiler:
The Collector-General after Harbinger leaves him. He looks so scared

Spoiler:
What I want to know is where exactly is it mentioned in game that Harbinger was controlling the Collector General? Because I only found that out from wikis. I didn't really feel sorry for him, probably only because I didn't quite understand at that point what was going on with him. And I don't get how something that doesn't have the slightest hint of facial expressions can look scared =/

And another thing I seem to have missed. After blowing up the Collector base, Legion says something about how we were offered "true unity" and "everything geth aspire to" and rejected it. Harbinger gave a lot of rhetoric about perfection and ascension but at what point were we offered anything other than being turned into goo? And 'offered' is not really the right word.
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Re: Mass Effect 2 is too hard to type. ME2

Postby SlyReaper » Wed Jun 23, 2010 11:23 am UTC

You see it in one of the final cutscenes.
Spoiler:
The collector general is at some console with a hologram of Harbinger and has glowing eyes. Then you hear Harbinger's voice say "releasing control of this form", and the collector general's eyes stop glowing. He turns around to see the approaching wall of firey death and looks kinda scared. You don't need a face to look scared - body language works too.
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Re: Mass Effect 2 is too hard to type. ME2

Postby ArgonV » Wed Jun 23, 2010 12:28 pm UTC

EdgarJPublius wrote:
This is relevant

and hilarious.

so clicky click


That's brilliant :D

I'm just wondering about Harbinger
Spoiler:
he seemed very different from Sovereign. Harbinger can be heard judging species during battles, in lines such as 'Salarian, insufficient lifespan, fragile genetic structure' and 'Geth, an annoyance, limited usability'. Humans, of course, are perfect. But Sovereign seemed to hold contempt for anything that wasn't a Reaper. And maybe the Reapers truly believe they're saving every race (worth saving) from extinction by taking millions/billions of them and turning them into a Reaper? Maybe that was along the lines of their original programming, which went horribly, horribly wrong somewhere.


And does anyone know how I can exchange my Revenant for a Widow? I chose the Revenant when I could and I'd hoped that I'd get to pick another gun second play through. Turns out I couldn't, but I'd really like that heavy snipers' rifle. I tried modding a save file, but that didn't work...

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Re: Mass Effect 2 is too hard to type. ME2

Postby Vaniver » Wed Jun 23, 2010 3:00 pm UTC

Spoiler:
thecommabandit wrote:After blowing up the Collector base, Legion says something about how we were offered "true unity" and "everything geth aspire to" and rejected it. Harbinger gave a lot of rhetoric about perfection and ascension but at what point were we offered anything other than being turned into goo? And 'offered' is not really the right word.
That's what he was talking about. Being turned into sapient goo that's used to construct a Reaper is "true unity"- millions of consciousnesses fused into one, powerful being. If the Geth could turn themselves into one Reaper-quality ship, they'd love to. (Emphasis, of course, on 'turn themselves.' The Geth like them some self-determination.)
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Re: Mass Effect 2 is too hard to type. ME2

Postby Azrael001 » Wed Jun 23, 2010 3:26 pm UTC

ArgonV wrote:I'm just wondering about Harbinger
Spoiler:
he seemed very different from Sovereign. Harbinger can be heard judging species during battles, in lines such as 'Salarian, insufficient lifespan, fragile genetic structure' and 'Geth, an annoyance, limited usability'. Humans, of course, are perfect. But Sovereign seemed to hold contempt for anything that wasn't a Reaper. And maybe the Reapers truly believe they're saving every race (worth saving) from extinction by taking millions/billions of them and turning them into a Reaper? Maybe that was along the lines of their original programming, which went horribly, horribly wrong somewhere.


And does anyone know how I can exchange my Revenant for a Widow? I chose the Revenant when I could and I'd hoped that I'd get to pick another gun second play through. Turns out I couldn't, but I'd really like that heavy snipers' rifle. I tried modding a save file, but that didn't work...
Spoiler:
I missed that Harbinger even really existed. I'm on my second play through so I'll pay more attention.
I don't recall the names of the sniper rifles, but I definately prefer the weaker, rapid fire one.
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Re: Mass Effect 2 is too hard to type. ME2

Postby Vaniver » Wed Jun 23, 2010 3:56 pm UTC

Spoiler:
Azrael001 wrote:I missed that Harbinger even really existed. I'm on my second play through so I'll pay more attention.
It's really easy to; he doesn't show up until the final cutscene, and as the voice that sounds like it's the Collector General talking to you, and the Collector Drone is a harbinger of the General, rather than Harbinger is a Reaper controlling a Collector.

Azrael001 wrote:I don't recall the names of the sniper rifles, but I definately prefer the weaker, rapid fire one.
The fact that it could take down four people or so per reload, and thus had ~20 kills to a full clip instead of ~10 or ~13 kills to a full clip, was really nice. But with an upgraded Widow, it takes at most two shots to kill almost everyone (the few exceptions being things like Krogan battlemasters with a barrier, armor, and health, who took 3, or things like Praetorians), and it's just satisfying to drop people with a single headshot, even if it requires reloading all the time.

My main problem ammo-wise was that I was at the front, and I was frequently behind cover, meaning I was using my highly limited ammo to shoot people, rather than sending the party up to take them out with their unlimited ammo. About half of the missions I was scrounging for ammo or had to switch off of the sniper rifle to something else.
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Re: Mass Effect 2 is too hard to type. ME2

Postby Azrael001 » Wed Jun 23, 2010 4:03 pm UTC

That's the one thing I miss from the first Mass Effect. I hate having to find ammo. Also, once I got my sniper skill up, I could fire as fast as the gun would let me and not worry about over heating. That was pretty nice.
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Re: Mass Effect 2 is too hard to type. ME2

Postby H2SO4 » Wed Jun 23, 2010 4:28 pm UTC

Azrael001 wrote:That's the one thing I miss from the first Mass Effect. I hate having to find ammo. Also, once I got my sniper skill up, I could fire as fast as the gun would let me and not worry about over heating. That was pretty nice.

I think that's what they were trying to fix. How much challenge is there in spray-and-pray? Very little.
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