Minecraft

Of the Tabletop, and other, lesser varieties.

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SurgicalSteel
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Re: Minecraft

Postby SurgicalSteel » Sun Feb 12, 2012 3:14 am UTC

You can't just make a 1x2 tunnel around the track and light it up like christmas?
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Steax
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Re: Minecraft

Postby Steax » Sun Feb 12, 2012 3:20 am UTC

Pigmen aren't affected by lighting.

The thing is, I've encountered pigmen in the 1x2 express track. Lining with slabs would at least make it easier to get around them, though. Right now it's really hard to get past at all.
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Re: Minecraft

Postby Manial » Sun Feb 12, 2012 5:22 am UTC

Steax wrote:Pigmen aren't affected by lighting.

The thing is, I've encountered pigmen in the 1x2 express track. Lining with slabs would at least make it easier to get around them, though. Right now it's really hard to get past at all.
That's interesting, I have never seen a pigman in the 1x2 express tunnels and from what I've read they can't spawn in them. Is it possible they spawned in a more open area and wandered into the tunnel?

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Re: Minecraft

Postby Kain » Sun Feb 12, 2012 5:45 am UTC

You could also do the glass is breathable trick...
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Re: Minecraft

Postby Steax » Sun Feb 12, 2012 7:02 am UTC

Manial wrote:
Steax wrote:Pigmen aren't affected by lighting.

The thing is, I've encountered pigmen in the 1x2 express track. Lining with slabs would at least make it easier to get around them, though. Right now it's really hard to get past at all.
That's interesting, I have never seen a pigman in the 1x2 express tunnels and from what I've read they can't spawn in them. Is it possible they spawned in a more open area and wandered into the tunnel?



I think the chances are tiny because they prefer to spawn in the large caverns above, but they still can.

Kain wrote:You could also do the glass is breathable trick...


The issue with that, as I found out the hard way, is if the game logs someone out while doing this, they respawn on the first empty pair of air blocks above of them, which usually means in a giant cave with ghasts all over the place. Or a block floating above lava. Or, if there is no cave, on the bedrock ceiling of the nether.
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Re: Minecraft

Postby blalobw » Sun Feb 12, 2012 12:00 pm UTC

A few quick thingies.


Meem, were you going to do any rework on the cave spider XP grinder?

Rirez, You mentioned wanting to start building the mob grinder, just bring the mobavator up anywhere in the industrial park's pit and I'll start working on the aboveground mob sorter. Or just mark where you're going to do it with a sign.

How about putting two meter drops on either side of the nether rail so that any pigmen that actually spawn on the tracks will usually fall off right away?

We have a plugin "Nethertopfix" that fixes the being on the nether ceiling problem. There's also an access ladder near 0,0 in case the plugin fails.

Manial's got a quite nice melon farm going.

I've whitelisted my neighbor's son, Jacob, he's been on my home server quite a bit in creative mode. I dunno how much he'll enjoy survival.

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Re: Minecraft

Postby Steax » Sun Feb 12, 2012 12:22 pm UTC

blalobw wrote:How about putting two meter drops on either side of the nether rail so that any pigmen that actually spawn on the tracks will usually fall off right away?


blalobw wrote:Where are the giant rooms full of redstone gizmos? Where are the intricately designed physics defying water flows? Why are there no pistons going thump thump, thump thump thumpa?


--

And yeah, I'll go find a spot... we'll have to see. Probably somewhere to the east, because we have several more people towards the east than the west.
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Re: Minecraft

Postby blalobw » Sun Feb 12, 2012 12:27 pm UTC

Steax wrote:
blalobw wrote:How about putting two meter drops on either side of the nether rail so that any pigmen that actually spawn on the tracks will usually fall off right away?


blalobw wrote:Where are the giant rooms full of redstone gizmos? Where are the intricately designed physics defying water flows? Why are there no pistons going thump thump, thump thump thumpa?


--

And yeah, I'll go find a spot... we'll have to see. Probably somewhere to the east, because we have several more people towards the east than the west.


??? Niether of those quotes have anything to do with each other, and your response does not seem to have anything to do with ither of the quotes. I am confused.

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Re: Minecraft

Postby Steax » Sun Feb 12, 2012 12:36 pm UTC

I was joking about your simple trench solution, while we were thinking of mechanical means. :p

Also, how big a space do you need above-ground? I think we can take space above the tree grove.
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Re: Minecraft

Postby jestingrabbit » Sun Feb 12, 2012 2:48 pm UTC

blalobw wrote:I've whitelisted my neighbor's son, Jacob, he's been on my home server quite a bit in creative mode. I dunno how much he'll enjoy survival.


I think he was wandering lost in the nether.
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Re: Minecraft

Postby blalobw » Sun Feb 12, 2012 3:08 pm UTC

Steax wrote:I was joking about your simple trench solution, while we were thinking of mechanical means. :p


Ahh, so I was talking to myself without being aware of it? That could become a problem, time to adjust my meds.

Steax wrote:Also, how big a space do you need above-ground? I think we can take space above the tree grove.


Everything should be able to fit in 30 by 30 or so, and it'll be at least 30 meters above ground level to insure that folks on second floors won't interfere with spider sorting.

I was kind of set on it being in the industrial park though. Now I'll have to figure out something else.

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Re: Minecraft

Postby SurgicalSteel » Sun Feb 12, 2012 4:09 pm UTC

blalobw wrote:How about putting two meter drops on either side of the nether rail so that any pigmen that actually spawn on the tracks will usually fall off right away?
What if they spawn directly on the track? Most pigmen I saw when I was down there seem to spawn and then not move, so they won't just wander off the track. And if one does spawn on the track and there's a gutter on either side of the rail it'll be difficult to get around them.
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Re: Minecraft

Postby bigglesworth » Sun Feb 12, 2012 4:31 pm UTC

Clearly the only solution is detector rails and arrow dispensers.
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Re: Minecraft

Postby Steax » Sun Feb 12, 2012 4:48 pm UTC

bigglesworth wrote:Clearly the only solution is detector rails and arrow dispensers.


That would make two carts approaching each other on the rail a lot more interesting than a friendly bump.
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Re: Minecraft

Postby jestingrabbit » Sun Feb 12, 2012 5:56 pm UTC

The wool factory is finished.

2012-02-13_04.37.46.png
2012-02-13_04.34.15.png


Possible future problems: sheep glitching vertically and we end up with rainbows of colours on every floor; the sheep eat all the grass on a level (though I have a solution for that); sheep take damage from bumping into stuff, die out on some levels before they can be replaced (which, again, I have a fix for, but its an insane amount of hassle).

To try to steer clear of the reparable problems, I'd ask that that we aim for 10 sheep per level, and a max of 3 babies at any time (they eat grass like crazy, 3 could eat nearly a quarter of all the grass on a level). This will make harvesting have only quite short waits, and none until you need more than about a third of a stack. Also, if you are anywhere in the complex with wheat in your hand, the sheep several levels above and below you will start going nuts at the doors. Shearing them seems to fix this.

edit: and just to mention something else: sheep parents can become confused about what they're following if there are a lot of baby sheep around. Please feed one level, wait for everything to grow up, then feed another level. I think it makes their pathing a lot less jumpy and easier to predict.

edit2: and there's two sets of double doors. Open one, get inside, close them, open the next set, close them after the sheep have left.
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Re: Minecraft

Postby Meem1029 » Mon Feb 13, 2012 6:44 am UTC

blalobw wrote:Meem, were you going to do any rework on the cave spider XP grinder?


If you want to finish it, go ahead. Otherwise, I can make sure to get on sometime in the next week or so to finish it up.
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Re: Minecraft

Postby Magnanimous » Mon Feb 13, 2012 7:16 am UTC

Manial and I were testing a system for the nether rail: a block of glass right above the rail, then a 1x2 space above it to "catch" you if you glitch. If no one has any objections or suggestions by tomorrow, I'll start installing it.

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Re: Minecraft

Postby mieulium » Mon Feb 13, 2012 11:18 am UTC

Goddamit. I keep finding "good spots" to build my house and it happens more than too often to have a mine underneath. :S And there's no chests !!! (so far)
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Re: Minecraft

Postby WarDaft » Mon Feb 13, 2012 8:37 pm UTC

... I have just discovered the Cow Dispenser.

I'll post a video as soon as I figure out how to record Minecraft (the application that came with my computer isn't working.)



... and apparently bumping stacks. So I have also discovered a cow based hyper-accelerator. It blasted me hundreds of blocks away in about 5 seconds.

Aha, the Fraps demo works while it's windowed. My findings:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qhDMjU5Eueg

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SFv1DVE81_I

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hQ-MG0v7mXQ

Hmm, they're kind-of dark once uploaded, I may have to wait for Minecraft morning to re-do them.
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Re: Minecraft

Postby Magnanimous » Mon Feb 13, 2012 10:54 pm UTC

Well that's awesome. I wonder how well it would work on a server...

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Re: Minecraft

Postby wam » Mon Feb 13, 2012 11:13 pm UTC

Would it be possible to get whitelasted for the sever. my minecraft username is wam15.

Also if you are nice enough to whitelist me are there any rules I need to be aware of?
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Re: Minecraft

Postby Steax » Tue Feb 14, 2012 1:19 am UTC

WarDaft wrote:... I have just discovered the Cow Dispenser.

I'll post a video as soon as I figure out how to record Minecraft (the application that came with my computer isn't working.)



... and apparently bumping stacks. So I have also discovered a cow based hyper-accelerator. It blasted me hundreds of blocks away in about 5 seconds.

Aha, the Fraps demo works while it's windowed. My findings:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qhDMjU5Eueg

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SFv1DVE81_I

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hQ-MG0v7mXQ

Hmm, they're kind-of dark once uploaded, I may have to wait for Minecraft morning to re-do them.


Is there a way to use that without the cows scattering? And how did you get them to turn like that?
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Re: Minecraft

Postby jestingrabbit » Tue Feb 14, 2012 7:18 am UTC

Update on the wool farm. 15 per level is the target population atm, but I'm thinking of letting them die back to about 13 or so. The herds at the moment are large enough to get the sheep pushing each other through/into the glass walls. Whilst they can be salvaged from there, its a real pain, and unaesthetic to just leave them there and replace them. But, at that size, the entire flock is never shorn it seems.

Long story short, its set up properly now, with a dive shaft to get down quickly, and level populations that are uniformly in the 14-16 range. So, for the time being do not take wheat onto the structure (unless the hell of sheep up to two levels above and below you having their crazy switches flipped sounds like something you want to fix).
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Re: Minecraft

Postby WarDaft » Tue Feb 14, 2012 8:28 am UTC

Steax wrote:Is there a way to use that without the cows scattering? And how did you get them to turn like that?

I can't think of any way. The bumping mechanics are effectively chaotic, because they were never designed for this. And they just turned like that on their own (I'm assuming you mean the cylindrical cow effect at the start)
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Re: Minecraft

Postby cephalopod9 » Tue Feb 14, 2012 8:53 am UTC

Steax wrote:
cephalopod9 wrote:I've been thinking about making a fancy map of the server. I have art supplies, like water colors and dip pens, but no cartography skills, and I don't know enough about the layout or it's history to do it on my own.


We can all help. Things are pretty much clear-cut, you just have people settling in to new locations. We're also kind of split into two continents at this point, and the transpacific railway is still in planning (and material-gathering).

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So I finally got around to doing some quick (crappy, tiny,) sketches to show my abilities. I like to draw (I don't have a lot of perspective on how good I am), but I'm pretty bad at visually organizing things to scale.
Spoiler:
Here's the Welcome Center, spawn, etc.
mainstreet.JPG


here's the Airship that's next to it
airship.JPG


and here is a snow golem
snowgolem.JPG

Anyone who wants to color, or improve on them is more then welcome to.

I'm leaning towards drawing everything separately, and stitching it together digitally afterwards. Otherwise, I'll need some help planning things out.

In the mean time, if you have a structure, or area you want to be on the fancy map, you can PM me a screen grab (coordinates, or a link to it on the map) and a description. There's a lot of creative liberties to be taken (I made the greenery along side the path at the Welcome Center into little shrubs, and drew the hat with a bow), so be as detailed as you want.
I might start a separate thread for discussion if there's a lot of interest. I'll probably add more detail and textures later, and I could add colors and maybe start using a ruler so my lines aren't so bad.
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Re: Minecraft

Postby phlip » Tue Feb 14, 2012 9:06 am UTC

WarDaft wrote:And they just turned like that on their own (I'm assuming you mean the cylindrical cow effect at the start)

Cylindrical Cow Effect is my new band name.

Code: Select all

enum ಠ_ಠ {°□°╰=1, °Д°╰, ಠ益ಠ╰};
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Re: Minecraft

Postby Magnanimous » Tue Feb 14, 2012 9:11 am UTC

cephalopod9 wrote:So I finally got around to doing some quick (crappy, tiny,) sketches to show my abilities. I like to draw (I don't have a lot of perspective on how good I am), but I'm pretty bad at visually organizing things to scale.
Cool! Or will be when there's more of it. A new thread might come in handy if you want a lot of details/history...
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Are you guys a Cylindrical Cow Affect tribute band?

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Re: Minecraft

Postby WarDaft » Tue Feb 14, 2012 9:23 am UTC

phlip wrote:
WarDaft wrote:And they just turned like that on their own (I'm assuming you mean the cylindrical cow effect at the start)

Cylindrical Cow Effect is my new band name.



Hmm, that's actually pretty catchy. I may have to add that to the video info. And something about a many-cows-interpretation if I can think of just the right way to phrase it.


....


It got better.
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Re: Minecraft

Postby Melic » Tue Feb 14, 2012 2:42 pm UTC

What if we have a 2 meter pit on one side of the nether track and on the other side pistons activated by preasure pads that go off in a wave in front of you, the redstone will be a nightmare, the noise almost unbareable and the resources needed unimaginable. Its perfect for this server. or we could dig a 1 meter pit in the bedrock roof for a track.
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Re: Minecraft

Postby jestingrabbit » Tue Feb 14, 2012 10:27 pm UTC

I think we've gotta keep comparing plans with the overworld rail option. Sure, there's a million batshit crazy ways to make a safe rail through the nether. The other option is making a safe rail in the overworld. I mean, if we were just going to have a single width rail on a single width line of planks for 15000 blocks, we'd need a little more than a double chest of logs and about 10 stacks of iron blocks. Plus a fair bit of gold... not sure how to calculate that.

That's pretty doable imo, I've got about a quarter of that atm, without even really trying. We should keep that possibility in mind is what I'm saying.
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Re: Minecraft

Postby Josephine » Tue Feb 14, 2012 11:00 pm UTC

At the maximum speed of a minecart, the 16000 blocks to waterworld plus the 7000 to pandora ends up being about 45 minutes of travel at the minecart's top speed of 8 m/s. That's a really long time ingame. If it's AFKable and doesn't require changing tracks and has no risk of mobs on the tracks, that's not so bad. It could also be reduced significantly by diagonal tracks bypassing Waterworld entirely. Minecarts have a top speed of 8 m/s in each direction, so on a diagonal that means 16 m/s. Combined with the shorter overall distance, that could probably bring it down to 30 minutes, though I haven't done that math.

There are alternative options, there exist piston and boat glitch-exploits to go as much as 60 m/s. But that's very resource intensive, and it's fast enough to be an issue for chunk loading, especially on a server.
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Re: Minecraft

Postby Magnanimous » Wed Feb 15, 2012 12:53 am UTC

Or, y'know, this works. I've tested it a lot on the server, and if the server crashes you just get kicked to the 1x3 part on top. The 1x2 part at the bottom is for maintenance, if any carts get stuck on the track.
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Re: Minecraft

Postby Steax » Wed Feb 15, 2012 1:55 am UTC

We're still mandated in the long-term to build the overworld rail, and the materials are still awaiting in the previous mountain base. That's probably once we get things properly up-and-running, since we're still missing several major farms in pandora right now.

@blal: How would a mob spawner be affected by some 200 sheep being nearby? Would they count towards the mob limit?
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Re: Minecraft

Postby WarDaft » Wed Feb 15, 2012 3:26 am UTC

Passive and hostile mobs have separate caps, it would be completely unaffected.
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Re: Minecraft

Postby jestingrabbit » Thu Feb 16, 2012 12:55 am UTC

Who the hell thought that dying every light grey sheep black in the wool farm was a good idea?
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Re: Minecraft

Postby Jahoclave » Thu Feb 16, 2012 6:53 am UTC

So I assume my old methods of nether transportation will require updating...

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Re: Minecraft

Postby Magnanimous » Thu Feb 16, 2012 10:23 am UTC

Construction of the Internether Glassrail is officially underway. Until it's fully complete we're just replacing pigmen-on-the-tracks with getting-kicked-to-the-roof-of-the-railway-if-you-lose-connection-while-mid-glass, but the second problem is at least fixable.

And you might still run into pigmen in some parts, because sloped rails will always have a 1x2 area where they can spawn. But those are so infrequent that we can install pistons, I guess.

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Re: Minecraft

Postby _infina_ » Thu Feb 16, 2012 5:17 pm UTC

I am working on a barn on the science server that I will build next to the bank on ST's server. It is going to hold pigs and mooshrooms. Someone else can build a chicken coop, if they think it is necessary.

EDIT: I would like to organize a trip from Pandora to the Antarctic Reaches. This will be a several hour journey, as I plan to build a pathway to it large enough to accommodate a future rail line to speed travel to it up.
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Re: Minecraft

Postby PhoenixEnigma » Thu Feb 16, 2012 10:24 pm UTC

In slightly more offbeat minecraft news:

Apparently, they're now going to be making minecraft lego sets. I can only believe this is a very elaborate setup for a "we need to go deeper!" joke.

EDIT: On further inspection, 6x6 chunks. I feel betrayed.
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Re: Minecraft

Postby tHe_kiiD » Fri Feb 17, 2012 12:36 am UTC

_infina_ wrote:I am working on a barn on the science server that I will build next to the bank on ST's server. It is going to hold pigs and mooshrooms. Someone else can build a chicken coop, if they think it is necessary.

EDIT: I would like to organize a trip from Pandora to the Antarctic Reaches. This will be a several hour journey, as I plan to build a pathway to it large enough to accommodate a future rail line to speed travel to it up.



When is said expedition happening? I might go to check out the lands, and maybe set up a base there.


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