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Re: Team Fortress 2

Posted: Mon Dec 07, 2009 4:44 pm UTC
by Madwolf
headprogrammingczar wrote:
Toeofdoom wrote:I've seen a pyro with crits... everyone backs away, no-one dies, crits did nothing. It sometimes works, but it's not on the same level as rockets or stickies.

Generally, a crit pyro is only useful if the other team is clustered together and doesn't see you coming, and in that case, why not just use the backburner?

Because you have to be behind them? :P

Re: Team Fortress 2

Posted: Mon Dec 07, 2009 5:47 pm UTC
by Box Boy
Are we talking about the same pyro? I've seen that thing take down a heavy AND his two medics.

Re: Team Fortress 2

Posted: Mon Dec 07, 2009 7:39 pm UTC
by lulzfish
There's this one Control Point / Arena map with shipping containers near its central point, I think it's Granary.
I recently amused myself by playing as Spy, using the Cloak and Dagger to camp on the shipping containers, and periodically sniping Heavies. I killed one or two and maybe another class (Snipers tend to move slowly) before I got shot.

The Cloak and Dagger is wonderful.

Re: Team Fortress 2

Posted: Mon Dec 07, 2009 9:31 pm UTC
by Mungo0
lulzfish wrote:There's this one Control Point / Arena map with shipping containers near its central point, I think it's Granary.
I recently amused myself by playing as Spy, using the Cloak and Dagger to camp on the shipping containers, and periodically sniping Heavies. I killed one or two and maybe another class (Snipers tend to move slowly) before I got shot.

The Cloak and Dagger is wonderful.


Hm, for camping, I use C&D too, but when I'm playing as a combative spy, I use the DR. Get it activated, run to nearest ammo source, re-disguise then uncloak. Generally, they think you're an ally. Of course, the loud sound is a problem, but most of the time, people don't really notice it.

Toeofdoom wrote:I've seen a pyro with crits... everyone backs away, no-one dies, crits did nothing. It sometimes works, but it's not on the same level as rockets or stickies.


Agreed. However, it's fun to use the Backburner, then flank them with a fellow pyro who has the firextinguisher axe. Many deaths occur, but it requires teamwork. Especially when trying to wipe out the enemy medics before they pop their Ubercharge.

However, I play mostly as a Scout. 84 or 85 hours on it now, and am an average scout. Still got a long way to go.

Re: Team Fortress 2

Posted: Mon Dec 07, 2009 10:22 pm UTC
by Wyvern
Rakysh wrote:Because you will get rocketed in the face. IN THE FACE.


Yeah... this. This is why you don't take the Backburner.

The Flamethrower is such an awesome thing to have when there's a crit rocket flying your way... (get that achievement yet?) :mrgreen:

Re: Team Fortress 2

Posted: Mon Dec 07, 2009 11:39 pm UTC
by lulzfish
Wyvern wrote:
Rakysh wrote:Because you will get rocketed in the face. IN THE FACE.


Yeah... this. This is why you don't take the Backburner.

The Flamethrower is such an awesome thing to have when there's a crit rocket flying your way... (get that achievement yet?) :mrgreen:

No, but I got Hot Potato for practicing... and not killing anybody.

If there's anything easier to dodge than a long-range rocket, it's a reflected long-range rocket. I don't have the reflexes to reflect them at a short enough range to be practical yet.

Re: Team Fortress 2

Posted: Tue Dec 08, 2009 7:31 am UTC
by LuNatic
lulzfish wrote:
Wyvern wrote:
Rakysh wrote:Because you will get rocketed in the face. IN THE FACE.


Yeah... this. This is why you don't take the Backburner.

The Flamethrower is such an awesome thing to have when there's a crit rocket flying your way... (get that achievement yet?) :mrgreen:

No, but I got Hot Potato for practicing... and not killing anybody.

If there's anything easier to dodge than a long-range rocket, it's a reflected long-range rocket. I don't have the reflexes to reflect them at a short enough range to be practical yet.


I don't have the reflexes, or the ping, so I try and predict when the soldier will fire his rocket. I get maybe 40% success. Best reflect I ever got was triple kill with a non-crit rocket :D

Re: Team Fortress 2

Posted: Tue Dec 08, 2009 7:39 am UTC
by Amnesiasoft
Pfft, it's even more fun to play crit rocket tennis. You usually don't run out of ammo before someone 'splodes.

Re: Team Fortress 2

Posted: Tue Dec 08, 2009 9:46 am UTC
by Xeio
Actually, I found a better use of air blast is to defend a sentry from rockets. In addition to spy checks makes an engineer/pyro team can make it very difficult to deal with. Though I still haven't figured out a good way to combat stickies, it's hard to airblast them away efficiently, and you have to be crazy fast/accurate with a shotgun to kill them before 2 are down next to the sentry.

Also, I still think snipers are most annoying for the instant kill at range. The spy at least has to be clever to get a backstab. Second is definately demo though, they seem way too strong, let alone if they're well played. I fear the demo update. :shock:

Re: Team Fortress 2

Posted: Tue Dec 08, 2009 12:11 pm UTC
by KrazyerKate
Xeio wrote:Though I still haven't figured out a good way to combat stickies, it's hard to airblast them away efficiently, and you have to be crazy fast/accurate with a shotgun to kill them before 2 are down next to the sentry.


I've found that the engineer's pistol is a bit better than his shotgun for taking out stickies, but rockets will always be the best sticky-clearer.

Re: Team Fortress 2

Posted: Tue Dec 08, 2009 3:38 pm UTC
by Toeofdoom
KrazyerKate wrote:
Toeofdoom wrote:Scouts that apparently exist just to piss off snipers.


whenever I need to blow off some steam I go to a 24/7 2fort server, jump across the bridge to the enemy battlements, and harass the snipers. I also rocketjump onto the battlements for the same reason. I'd apologize, but I think snipers deserve it.

On 2fort, I agree, 2fort is pretty bad like that... but on the start of a payload map, instead of helping around the cart or whatever... this scout runs around the side and accomplishes nothing but killing me.

Normally I'd try to find a place with a sentry covering me but we only had 1 engi this time... kinda my fault really :P

Re: Team Fortress 2

Posted: Wed Dec 09, 2009 4:29 am UTC
by Wyvern
Nobody Seems to remember That the scout captures at double speed... a few scouts on the cart makes it go reaaaaalllllllyy fast. really.


Oh, and There was a sneaky little update yesterday that added some new files on the sly - And It sounds like they're preparing something big.

Luckily, someone already uploaded them to youtube for our viewing pleasure.

Re: Team Fortress 2

Posted: Wed Dec 09, 2009 6:02 am UTC
by Cynical Idealist
Wyvern wrote:Luckily, someone already uploaded them to youtube for our viewing pleasure.

This...sounds like something epic.

Re: Team Fortress 2

Posted: Wed Dec 09, 2009 7:14 am UTC
by EdgarJPublius
Here's a link to the best steam forum thread for discussion of the new sound files.

Actually though, the 'mystery' appears to have been solved, on the eleventh page of that thread, someone posted a portion of code from the server binary that indicates soldiers and demos have a 10% chance of hearing the new soundfiles instead of one of the old soundfiles, a pretty solid indicator that this is something to do with a Soldier/Demo class update.

it's too much to hope that it will also be an item trade/craft system update I suppose :/

Re: Team Fortress 2

Posted: Thu Dec 10, 2009 12:56 am UTC
by Naurgul
Valve have just put up this comic. I suppose they're getting the hype going for a dual soldier/demo update with all this.

Re: Team Fortress 2

Posted: Thu Dec 10, 2009 2:14 am UTC
by Greatgreen
I hang out on the scourged Team Fortress 2 forums, and yes, Soldier/Demo update is the current popular opinion. It actually looks like it may end up being a competition to see who gets the new update or some such.

Re: Team Fortress 2

Posted: Thu Dec 10, 2009 3:12 am UTC
by Upsilon
The comic says "competition".

Maybe the Soldier and the Demoman are getting the same unlockables?

Re: Team Fortress 2

Posted: Thu Dec 10, 2009 4:21 am UTC
by aion7
I would think that a demo/engie update would make more sense than a demo/soldier, as they are mortal enemies, similar to spy/sniper. In any case, I will appreciate any new class updates/item trading/maps/modes.

Re: Team Fortress 2

Posted: Thu Dec 10, 2009 11:23 pm UTC
by KrazyerKate
aion7 wrote:I would think that a demo/engie update would make more sense than a demo/soldier, as they are mortal enemies, similar to spy/sniper. In any case, I will appreciate any new class updates/item trading/maps/modes.


that makes sense, but I'd much rather have the engineer update happen on its own. Having games full of soldiers and demomen would still stay balanced, but the moment the engineer gets an update we're going to have crazy turtlefests. I'd rather the turtlefest happens after we've got all the tools possible to deal with it.

I also hope that when the engineer update happens, that he gets an entirely new building to play with. I was disappointed when I found out that spies were just getting modified cloaks instead of entirely new spy gadgets, and I'm going to be equally disappointed if, after the update, engineers can still only build teleporters, dispensers, and SGs.

Re: Team Fortress 2

Posted: Fri Dec 11, 2009 5:15 am UTC
by Wyvern
Has no one seen this yet?

It's a Soldier/Demo update. And whichever Class Kills more of the other will get an extra weapon when the update rolls around at the end of the week.

This is some cool beans.


(Go Soldier.)

Re: Team Fortress 2

Posted: Fri Dec 11, 2009 5:21 am UTC
by guyy
Well, that was a quick turnaround.

I've got finals coming up, so I won't have time for TF2; though I'm not sure that's a bad thing. I expect most servers for the next week will be 45% Demos, 45% Soldiers, and 10% WISHY-WASHY COWARDS...er, other classes.

(You WILL play SOLDIER and kill MANY HONORLESS UN-MEN who LACK DEPTH PERCEPTION!)

Re: Team Fortress 2

Posted: Fri Dec 11, 2009 7:05 am UTC
by lulzfish
Interesting.
Sadly, I almost never play either of those classes.

I usually do Pyro or Heavy or Medic, though lately I've been trying Spy and Scout.

Occasionally I play Demoman if my team are idiots and can't break down sentries, but I almost never play Soldier.

Re: Team Fortress 2

Posted: Fri Dec 11, 2009 9:41 am UTC
by Xeio
Maybe it's just me, but suddenly I can't beat soldiers, maybe everyone who is awesome at soldier normally plays other classes, but goddamn, those rocket jumping bastards are slaughtering me. And this war isn't exactly a help with demospam either. I've resorted to playing support classes for now, we'll see if I'm just having an off day or something.

Re: Team Fortress 2

Posted: Fri Dec 11, 2009 12:13 pm UTC
by KrazyerKate
guyy wrote:Well, that was a quick turnaround.

I've got finals coming up, so I won't have time for TF2; though I'm not sure that's a bad thing. I expect most servers for the next week will be 45% Demos, 45% Soldiers, and 10% WISHY-WASHY COWARDS...er, other classes.

(You WILL play SOLDIER and kill MANY HONORLESS UN-MEN who LACK DEPTH PERCEPTION!)


If this weapon is anything more than cosmetic, the soldier deserves it. There are far too many sticky-camping demomen in this world to give them a fourth weapon. I plan on playing medic to keep our soldiers alive, but the demomen on my team can go find their own damn health.

Also, how is Valve going to stop farming on this one?

Re: Team Fortress 2

Posted: Fri Dec 11, 2009 1:07 pm UTC
by Toeofdoom
There are plenty of ways... I'd start with finding a demo to soldier kill ratio for each server, and a war kill vs non war kill ratio for each server, then identify types of servers that aren't playing fair.

Re: Team Fortress 2

Posted: Fri Dec 11, 2009 2:27 pm UTC
by thecommabandit
KrazyerKate wrote:Also, how is Valve going to stop farming on this one?

They can't. It's literally not possible. But that's not a problem as I'm betting that thanks to the law of averages they'll be just as many people who farm Demomen kills as Soldier kills. I think it's gonna be close, like a few thousand kills between them.

Re: Team Fortress 2

Posted: Fri Dec 11, 2009 3:20 pm UTC
by headprogrammingczar
They might have a couple of people going through the list of servers by hand, picking ones that have wild soldier:demo ratios or high kill/minute rates and removing them.

Re: Team Fortress 2

Posted: Fri Dec 11, 2009 5:28 pm UTC
by Toeofdoom
Like I said... they can automate that shit. enter stats from each server into a database, chuck a few queries in and take servers out.

Re: Team Fortress 2

Posted: Fri Dec 11, 2009 5:33 pm UTC
by Box Boy
Which will no doubt piss off all the dedicated Soldiers and Demomen players.

Re: Team Fortress 2

Posted: Fri Dec 11, 2009 7:25 pm UTC
by guyy
Box Boy wrote:Which will no doubt piss off all the dedicated Soldiers and Demomen players.


That shouldn't really be a problem, if they do it right. Just calculate [demo war-kills / soldier war-kills] in each round on each server; if it's stupidly high or low (less than 0.1 or more than 10, maybe), or if it stays oddly high or low for many rounds in a row, throw out the data from those rounds. For the most part, that should only affect farmers and professional players intentionally hanging around in new-player servers to rack up kills.

Re: Team Fortress 2

Posted: Fri Dec 11, 2009 10:26 pm UTC
by Wyvern
They posted the war totals so far!

And the soldier is up by about 100k kills. Not really surprising, I was almost expecting a bigger gap between them.

Though, I'm terrible with both of those classes, and all the explosions make things pretty difficult, so I've defaulted back to Medic. Medic is always a credit to the team.

Re: Team Fortress 2

Posted: Sat Dec 12, 2009 11:32 am UTC
by MysteryBall
Personally, I absolutely detest scouts, with a passion. Then comes the soldier. The rest I have no problem with. Maybe Pyros when I'm doing a bit of espionage.

Demoman to win. :3

Re: Team Fortress 2

Posted: Sat Dec 12, 2009 3:51 pm UTC
by KrazyerKate
The soldier is by far the most boring class. How can you feel anything but "meh" toward it? Liking the demoman better I can understand, but hating the soldier? really? do you hate toast too? what about canada?

Re: Team Fortress 2

Posted: Sat Dec 12, 2009 4:07 pm UTC
by Box Boy
KrazyerKate wrote:What about canada?

Hey, Canada aren't boring!
They have Maple syrup and hockey and Jessica and, em, uhhh, Avril Lavigne?
.....
Nickelback?

Re: Team Fortress 2

Posted: Sun Dec 13, 2009 4:11 am UTC
by Ishindri
http://www.teamfortress.com/war/part3/index.htm

Fuck yeah item crafting. Camera Beard, here I come.

Re: Team Fortress 2

Posted: Sun Dec 13, 2009 6:21 am UTC
by guyy
Interestingly, in the crafting screenshot, there seems to be a shovel in the backpack, which...looks exactly like the regular one. Does this mean you can craft standard weapons for absolutely no reason, since you already have them? Is it the Soldier's new melee before it got its own icon? Or what? Kind of odd.

Also, with my dozen Dead Ringers, I'd better be able to make a camera beard that's the size of a Heavy. And shoots lasers.

Re: Team Fortress 2

Posted: Sun Dec 13, 2009 6:33 am UTC
by aion7
Maybe now I can get an axetinguisher. Or a hat.

Re: Team Fortress 2

Posted: Sun Dec 13, 2009 6:43 am UTC
by Rakysh
NATASCHA! SHE WILL BE MINE!

Looks like now you will be able to get duplicate basic weapons, which is nice.

Re: Team Fortress 2

Posted: Sun Dec 13, 2009 7:16 am UTC
by Ishindri
guyy wrote:there seems to be a shovel in the backpack, which...looks exactly like the regular one.

As I understand it, dev accounts have actual backpack copies of the basic weapons. I don't think it's indicative of anything special.

Re: Team Fortress 2

Posted: Sun Dec 13, 2009 8:09 am UTC
by Jorpho
This seems to be a rather sensible and innovative solution to the whole item dilemma. No achievement whoring, no idling, no anguished forum whining... in theory, anyway.