[SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQA Thread - Queer Support!

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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQ Thread - Queer Support!

Postby Zohar » Tue May 19, 2009 6:07 am UTC

The word "homophobe" contains the word fear in it. But shouldn't there be a term for someone who's not necessarily afraid, but hateful? You don't call someone who hates Jews a "semiphobe", they're antisemitic. I'm certain a lot of the hate towards homosexuals and their ilk is based on fear, but not always fear leads to hate (sorry Yoda), sometimes hate just springs up on its own. I would call someone who doesn't want to spend time with gays, someone who's worried they'll infect him (literally or with their ideas) a homophobe. But someone who just says they're sick or should be killed etc., it doesn't mean he's afraid. I looked a bit in wiki but I didn't find something specifically about alternate words for homophobia (mostly stuff about how it's a negative word which automatically categorizes those who disapprove gays as bad).
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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQ Thread - Queer Support!

Postby ZLVT » Tue May 19, 2009 12:32 pm UTC

there's a thread in linguistis on terms which woudl be more suitable. It was interesting. I think homosexist was the best.
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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQ Thread - Queer Support!

Postby mf92 » Tue May 19, 2009 1:44 pm UTC

I have a question to those who are transexuals/transgendered (or others who may have an answer, I suppose):

What does it mean to you to be a man/woman? There's obviously something there besides your anatomical parts that makes you the gender you are, but I can't seem to pinpoint it. I'm a female (anatomically and psychologically) and I don't feel like I'm male, but I don't know WHAT it is that makes me a woman. It has nothing to do with one's choice in clothes (as most of my clothes are unisex and some are actually from the men's side of a store), genitalia, or sexual preference, so what is it?

In this question, I'm assuming that those of you who are transexual or transgendered are more aware of what makes you male or female, but you could be just as clueless as I am! Sorry if that's the case.

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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQ Thread - Queer Support!

Postby Jessica » Tue May 19, 2009 3:09 pm UTC

I believe that there are multiple dimensions of one's self. I'm gonna pull this directly from a book I'm reading. Julia Serano calls it the intrinsic inclination model to explain gender and sexual variation.

There are 4 continuums which are intrinsic in our being (as in, they really can't be changed...)
Conscious sex
Subconscious sex
Gender expression
Sexual orientation

Each one has multiple states between each end, and distributes into double bell curves, such that we receive (on average) a bimodal view of society (Male vs female, gay vs straight, feminine vs masculine) but that these are not the only options.

Personally, I'm pretty feminine right now, but I'm not the most feminine girl in the world. I was a sort of masculine boy when I presented as one, but again, not the most masculine boy. I emphasize different aspects at different times. While I was born physically male, I started to realize as I got older that something wasn't right. Or, I should say, that something wasn't the same as everyone else. As I realized the things I can't really do, or things which weren't normal, it started to hurt. It was small at first, but over time I started to realize that the pain was caused by an incongruence between how I looked, and people treated me, and how I felt. I was jealous of women. I was envious of women. I used to think that I loved women so much I wanted to be one. But that's not really right. It's... kind of hard to explain. But I just felt female. Not in any sense I could know. I mean, I can't say I was a woman trapped in a man's body, because that's so simplistic it doesn't really explain how I felt. I mean, how could I know what it was like to be female, so how could I know I felt like one. But... the idea of being a woman, or acting feminine, or being considered female seemed right. Like it helped the pain go away.

Uh, what was I trying to say again? How do I know I was a woman, even though I physically was male? I just felt this difference between how people treated me, how I looked, and how I feel inside. How do I know that this subconscious sex exists? Well, because I experienced it. But, you know that thought experiment people play from time to time "Would you want to spend time as the opposite sex?" I think most people seem to say "sure, why not" but they also have this concept of a time limit, like for a week, or a day. If it was permanent, fewer people are as willing to swap.

eh, whatever.
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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQ Thread - Queer Support!

Postby Delalyra » Tue May 19, 2009 4:20 pm UTC

Fwiw, Jess, I found that insightful and informative. Thanks.
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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQ Thread - Queer Support!

Postby H.E.L.e.N. » Tue May 19, 2009 4:27 pm UTC

I don't think it answers the question (and I haven't remotely finished the book yet), but I found the following useful:

Kate Bornstein wrote:When I was a kid, everyone else seemed to know they were boys or girls or men or women. That's something I've never known; not then, not today. I never got to say to the grownups, "Hold on there -- just what is it about me that makes you think I'm a little boy?" As a kid, I just figured I was the crazy one; I was the one who had some serious defect.

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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQ Thread - Queer Support!

Postby poxic » Wed May 20, 2009 12:24 am UTC

I was chatting with someone a few days ago about the concept of being nongendered. She described her experience as "there are women over there, and men over there, and here's me in the middle being totally normal. I just don't understand why more people aren't normal."

I rather like her assumption of normality. Me, I always assumed that I was the one at fault, that I was doing something wrong because I didn't feel what I was supposed to. Heh.

For me, I've just never fit into any classical definition (stereotype?) of being female, or male. I just feel... human. As though, if I had been born with the choice of gender/sex left up to me, I might not have made a decision yet. I'd just be content wandering around as "none of the above".
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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQ Thread - Queer Support!

Postby DJorgensen » Wed May 20, 2009 9:10 am UTC

poxic wrote: I just feel... human.

I often don't :P
Currently I'm feeling more reptilian. Anklyosaurian to be exact. ^^;
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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQ Thread - Queer Support!

Postby eternal luna » Wed May 20, 2009 10:12 am UTC

I presented as male today and, people, I think I may actually be able to pull this off :shock: It required more attention to my face than I could maintain (stripping my lips and cheeks of rosiness, and lightening my eyelids- I always look as though I'm wearing eye-shadow for some reason) but I heard "Hey, look at that guy's hair!" twice from school kids, scared a younger boy just by walking behind him, and didn't get catcalled at- even when I walked through a construction site, and instead was laughed at for looking feminine by a bunch of construction workers in a passing truck. I hadn't realised how used to hooting or whistling or thrusting I was since I only noticed the absence of it. *Glee* I've never felt so confident walking by myself before.
poxic wrote:I just feel... human.
I think I'm finally coming to terms with this- the feeling of being in between labels and the possibility that they'll never fit, with the knowledge that that's okay too. Possibly because I'm still floating high above my insecurities.
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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQ Thread - Queer Support!

Postby Maelstrom. » Wed May 20, 2009 10:39 am UTC

Go luna! What does one have to do to present as a male? Binding ones chest is an obvious start, but what else is involved, if you dont mind me asking?

But is that construction worker stereotype really real? Seriously? I thought that was just a characature played upon for laughs. Makes me even more ashamed of males in general :(

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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQ Thread - Queer Support!

Postby DJorgensen » Wed May 20, 2009 11:39 am UTC

Yay luna <3

Maelstrom. wrote:But is that construction worker stereotype really real? Seriously?

Yeah its real, though not all construction workers, and often guys who are not in construction either.
I've noticed the same between presenting as boy, andro, and female.
When walking alone, I really can't manage anything other than boy or andro. I just don't feel safe enough to manage otherwise. :/
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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQ Thread - Queer Support!

Postby Jessica » Wed May 20, 2009 3:52 pm UTC

Yay Luna!! :D
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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQ Thread - Queer Support!

Postby Sock Puppet Pal » Wed May 20, 2009 10:19 pm UTC

Please forgive the sockpuppet; I have friends that read xkcd and might browse the fora.
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I'm intersexed. Female parts (minus ovaries) and male chromosomes. According to the doc, my body is fully sexually functional. (hooray!)

I'm 20, never really been in a relationship for fear of rejection. How should I go about telling someone that I'm interested in that I"m intersexed? I currently have a weird "not dating, but not looking for other people relationship" with wonderful grad student right now. Should I tell him now? I'm sure that he wouldn't reject me on a genetic basis. But it feels like I'm lying to him in a twisted sort of way. Should I wait to tell him or what? Ideas?

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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQ Thread - Queer Support!

Postby H.E.L.e.N. » Wed May 20, 2009 10:37 pm UTC

(I have so very clearly never been in your situation, so I especially don't want to seem heavy-handed and advice-y, but:)

From what you're describing, it sounds like this is something you would want to put out there to put your own mind at ease. Which sounds like a reasonable thing to do, since you are in such a good place with your partner. It sounds (to me) like waiting would make things harder to talk about.

Have you been able to mention what's up with you to anyone before? Just because more people to talk to makes things less stressful, sometimes.

Edit: And there are probably so many ways to frame it, but starting somewhere like "I have a medical condition where I don't have ovaries," I don't think that would be a scary thing to learn about a partner.

Also, hugs.

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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQ Thread - Queer Support!

Postby DJorgensen » Wed May 20, 2009 10:50 pm UTC

Sock Puppet Pal wrote:Please forgive the sockpuppet; I have friends that read xkcd and might browse the fora.
--

I'm intersexed. Female parts (minus ovaries) and male chromosomes. According to the doc, my body is fully sexually functional. (hooray!)

I'm 20, never really been in a relationship for fear of rejection. How should I go about telling someone that I'm interested in that I"m intersexed? I currently have a weird "not dating, but not looking for other people relationship" with wonderful grad student right now. Should I tell him now? I'm sure that he wouldn't reject me on a genetic basis. But it feels like I'm lying to him in a twisted sort of way. Should I wait to tell him or what? Ideas?

CAIS? cool :3 that means that you are the perfect female.

In all reality its probably easiest to say that you were born without the ability to have kids. If you feel female, and present as female (and I would assume you are on hormones due to the lack of ovaries although this may or may not be the case of course), then really that's what you are. If they ask further into it and are open and respectful and willing to accept others, then by all means you can explain it further.

Bringing it up is probably going to be the most difficult to time nicely. If the matter of sex comes up, or birth control, or medical conditions, or medication - those are all probably opportune times to mention that you can't have kids due to not having ovaries. Disclosing genetics right off the bat isn't entirely necessary though...
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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQ Thread - Queer Support!

Postby mf92 » Thu May 21, 2009 1:09 am UTC

Thanks to everyone for your answers! It seems that no one here really knows what the "definition" of being a male or female is (it's such an elusive thing, so this isn't a surprise).

Jessica, I suppose it's hard for me to understand completely what you are speaking of since I am not personally experiencing what you are, but you gave a great explanation. I'm not quite sure if this analogy works, but: I don't know if you're familiar with this, but if someone has warm or cold water dropped into their ear they will experience the sensation of spinning. The change of the temperature of the liquid that is around the semicircular canals causes convection currents, in turn creating this feeling of movement when there is none. If you see this happen to someone you'll notice that their eyes actually move to keep up with the "movement" going on around them. While they are not physically moving, the sensation is real to them and it is what they experience. I'm assuming this is what it must feel as a transgendered person, you really ARE a male/female on the inside, but you aren't presenting the physical body parts? Please let me know if this is completely off. Sorry for all the questions, I just like to understand.

Poxic, I like your friend's idea on gender. She seems very content with herself, which is always a good thing.

Sockpuppet, I don't see what the problem is or why you would need to tell this guy about being intersexed. Lots of women have high levels of androgen and it doesn't cause any problems in their relationships. Hell, some women have their ovaries and fallopian tubes completely removed (see: oophorosalpingectomy) for medical purposes. I don't see your case being any different than that. I wouldn't really worry about telling any guy this unless you are in a serious relationship and just feel like sharing it.

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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQ Thread - Queer Support!

Postby cephalopod9 » Thu May 21, 2009 9:40 am UTC

I just found this image: (spoilered for space)
It's the same androgynous (gynandrous?) face with different levels of contrast, the one with more appearing more feminine. I thought it was interesting, and is one of those things that sort of highlights how arbitrary a distinction it can be.(hope I'm not drifting off topic too much).
Image

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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQ Thread - Queer Support!

Postby diotimajsh » Thu May 21, 2009 11:01 am UTC

I guess some guys might feel a little weird discovering that their girlfriend has a Y chromosome.

I tend to think that those people aren't really worth dating anyway.
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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQ Thread - Queer Support!

Postby Zohar » Thu May 21, 2009 11:11 am UTC

diotimajsh wrote:I guess some guys might feel a little weird discovering that their girlfriend has a Y chromosome.

I tend to think that those people aren't really worth dating anyway.

Just because someone has difficulty with a new concept doesn't mean they're not worth the effort or they're a bad person. Especially if it's someone that hasn't been exposed to anything like that in the past.
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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQ Thread - Queer Support!

Postby michaelandjimi » Thu May 21, 2009 11:20 am UTC

Zohar is correct. It may take some understanding on your part, Sockpuppet. Understanding that you don't owe, and shouldn't have to impart. It's up to you to decide whether he is worth it. If he deserves you, he ought to come around fairly quickly.
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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQ Thread - Queer Support!

Postby sje46 » Sat May 30, 2009 3:47 am UTC

Can I ask a question to all the fine gaylesbianbitransetc people in here?
I understand that "gaydar" exists, and that people are usually born with their orientation. But one thing that always annoy me is when people "out" others. Like I would watch Conan O'Brien, and my mom would say "he's so gay!" She thinks that his mannerisms betray him. I honestly doubt he is. Not only does he have a wife and daughter, and hits on the female guests a lot, but I think he would be honest about it. And I'm sure that in the 15 years or so he has had the show, someone would have figured it out for sure.
I always thought that gaydar referred to gay people specifically standing in certain ways, or something sending out signals that other gay people would be attuned to. But if you didn't want to be outted, do you send out these signals anyway? Is it an unchangable fact that you are going to act effeminent?
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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQ Thread - Queer Support!

Postby Carnildo » Sat May 30, 2009 4:23 am UTC

According to the studies of "gaydar" I've seen, gay men are reasonably able to identify other gay men based on observation. Nobody else can manage it at rates much better than random chance, and the overt signs you mention such as "effeminancy" are somewhere between misleading and useless for identifying homosexuals.

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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQ Thread - Queer Support!

Postby sje46 » Sat May 30, 2009 4:36 am UTC

Carnildo wrote:According to the studies of "gaydar" I've seen, gay men are reasonably able to identify other gay men based on observation. Nobody else can manage it at rates much better than random chance, and the overt signs you mention such as "effeminancy" are somewhere between misleading and useless for identifying homosexuals.

Thank you. I'm not really surprised that my mom or anyone else wh's straight completely fails at it. What is more important to me is the idea that people can send off gay vibes even if they don't want to. That any person skilled in the art of gaydar would be able to tell if someone is gay even if that other person wants to keep it totally secret, even from other gay people.
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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQ Thread - Queer Support!

Postby Hyphe » Sat May 30, 2009 10:05 am UTC

Excuse me, but what the hell are "gay vibes"? :x
Gay people aren't any different from straight people, bisexuals, queers, whatever. There is no such things as "gaydar" or gay vibes, just stereotypes people like to apply. He likes flowers? Oh, he *must* be gay. That girl has a short haircut and doesn't want to date me, she's a lesbian, clearly.

I think gay men may be able to identify other gay men simply because they're paying more attention to who is being flirted with/eyed up. Which anyone can do if they actually pay attention. But I've not seen any studies like that, so I remain skeptical.

tl:dr; No, if you don't tell someone that you're gay, anyone else who says so is just guessing.

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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQ Thread - Queer Support!

Postby DJorgensen » Sat May 30, 2009 10:08 am UTC

Every girl that I've really truly been interested (even at a distance) has turned out to be bi or gay. I'm pretty really good at it. I just go for the hotter / more interesting ones in my minds eye and it tends to work.
Gay guys I've never been able to tell though.

But yes, it is always just a guessing game.
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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQ Thread - Queer Support!

Postby sje46 » Sat May 30, 2009 10:34 am UTC

Hyphe wrote:Excuse me, but what the hell are "gay vibes"? :x

What do you think it is? It's what I'm asking exist.
Gay people aren't any different from straight people, bisexuals, queers, whatever. There is no such things as "gaydar" or gay vibes, just stereotypes people like to apply. He likes flowers? Oh, he *must* be gay. That girl has a short haircut and doesn't want to date me, she's a lesbian, clearly.

I think gay men may be able to identify other gay men simply because they're paying more attention to who is being flirted with/eyed up. Which anyone can do if they actually pay attention. But I've not seen any studies like that, so I remain skeptical.

tl:dr; No, if you don't tell someone that you're gay, anyone else who says so is just guessing.

I'm not talking about being flamboyant or dressing any particular way. I'm talking about vibes, about unconscious things. I don't know if you find the word "vibes" offensive or anything, but I think it communicates what I'm talking about pretty well. Unconscious signals.
For example, if you gesture in a different direction than you're looking, some people (like, psychologists, or whatever) will read that body language as saying that you are being dishonest. You are sending unconscious signals that you are lying.
If it is just random guessing, then I guess gay people are just plain lucky.
http://www.psychologytoday.com/articles/pto-20051018-000007.html
http://journals.cambridge.org/action/displayAbstract?fromPage=online&aid=164005
http://www.scientificamerican.com/article.cfm?id=something-queer-about-that-face
So what I'm asking is if a person with good gaydar (which does exist; I mean, at least read the Wikipedia article) can identify a person who is trying to act straight--trying to keep it a secret. So they are not dressing in leather and cutting hair or anything. Do they have different body language? Do they have different speech? Women, for example, tend to frame things in questions instead of just declaring things ("Isn't it a nice day today?" as opposed to "It's nice out today"). I don't think most women really know that they do that until it's pointed out.
I mean, I heard that gay people stand in certain ways as a signal to other gay men--is this done on purpose, or not?

With that last link, I'm starting to think that people don't choose to give off these signals, but I'd like the opinion of people who are actually gay.
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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQ Thread - Queer Support!

Postby acb » Sat May 30, 2009 12:59 pm UTC

My experiences are similar to DJorgensen's in that a lot of the people I like also turn out to be gay or bi, but I don't notice any specific signals.

The only thing I ever heard that made any sense to me for working out someone's sexuality was to see how they look at other people of the same sex. It is fairly easy to tell if someone is checking someone out, so if there is someone around that they like it can work quite well.

However if they are trying to keep it a secret then I don't think there is really any way to tell - there might be a few things that make me suspect they might be, but it is only guesswork and as such is often wildly inaccurate. The only thing that really works (for me anyway) is to wait until they say something.

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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQ Thread - Queer Support!

Postby aging.child » Sat May 30, 2009 1:06 pm UTC

I don't know if it's so much unconscious signals as it is something even more subtle. I know that pheromones play a big part in the way straight people fall in love, I just assumed that the same was true for gay people. Even though neither person consciously notices it. It's like when women who live together synchronize their menstrual periods. This link might be interesting: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biology_and_sexual_orientation
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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQ Thread - Queer Support!

Postby H.E.L.e.N. » Sat May 30, 2009 10:01 pm UTC

There's conscious signaling too, whether it's fashion-related or mentioning something queer-related in conversation and see if they pick up on it. (This is more something I've had recommended than anything I actually do.) But it's not stereotyping if it's a conscious attempt to keep my fingernails well-trimmed.

It is stereotyping if "everyone who does [stereotypical action] must be [orientation]," or vice versa, but I feel like people around here might be smart enough to know that.

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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQ Thread - Queer Support!

Postby steewi » Mon Jun 01, 2009 3:29 am UTC

My best friend, who's getting married next week, is frequently someone who people who claim to have gaydar (gay and straight) say is gay. He's flamboyant, but not flamingly so. I'm kinda flamboyant, but in a different way. Most people don't seem to pick up on my "gay vibes", especially when I'm being careful. Recently, as in over the last year or so, I've been less careful, so some people have picked up on it. So what's different? I'm less worried about saying something "gay" like admitting to watching (and liking) musicals, or bursting into song, or mock-flirting with men (as well as women). If someone makes a "wow, that really made you look gay" comment about something I've just done, I don't necessarily deny it, but just move on.

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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQ Thread - Queer Support!

Postby sje46 » Mon Jun 01, 2009 3:35 am UTC

I don't see how it is gay to like musicals or whatever.
I doubt that people who are gay like musicals only because they are gay.
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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQ Thread - Queer Support!

Postby poxic » Mon Jun 01, 2009 3:46 am UTC

Doesn't it make a nice change to actually feel *free* to talk about one's own interests, and to act the way one feels, rather than worrying about others' perceptions? I need to find more friends around whom I can do that...

/thank the universe I'm in IT, where weirdos are more or less par for the course
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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQ Thread - Queer Support!

Postby DJorgensen » Mon Jun 01, 2009 7:44 am UTC

poxic wrote:Doesn't it make a nice change to actually feel *free* to talk about one's own interests, and to act the way one feels, rather than worrying about others' perceptions? I need to find more friends around whom I can do that...

/thank the universe I'm in IT, where weirdos are more or less par for the course

ditto that. :D
and when not in IT I'm in the art world... where it's mandatory.
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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQ Thread - Queer Support!

Postby steewi » Tue Jun 02, 2009 1:32 am UTC

poxic wrote:Doesn't it make a nice change to actually feel *free* to talk about one's own interests, and to act the way one feels, rather than worrying about others' perceptions? I need to find more friends around whom I can do that...

Yes, definitely. One of my favourite things is being able to watch a movie or chat or whatever with someone I'm out to and I know I'm safe with, because I can say something like "Oh me yarm, that was totally hot!" when Gerard Butler takes his shirt off or something, instead of sitting there and trying to look only vaguely interested when I'm panting inside. Or, on the lesser scale, to be able to talk about my favourite musicals without having someone say "Oh me yarm that's totally gay". That doesn't just apply to people I'm out to. I can still do that around most of my friends who I'm not out to, but there are a lot of people I seriously change the way I act around because I just don't feel comfortable with the conclusions that are jumped to over it.
sje46 wrote:I don't see how it is gay to like musicals or whatever.
I doubt that people who are gay like musicals only because they are gay.

Of course not. But the cultural myths are still perpetuated, and they're not going anywhere, so we have to live with the idea that if you say you're into musicals/broadway/fashion/CareBears, people will jump to that conclusion. It's not too much of a problem if you're comfortable with being straight and liking CareBears or if you're gay and proud of it, but if you're closeted and trying not to be obvious about it, then it can be a problem. The general public doesn't have the intelligence level of the fora to remember that a vague correlation (i.e. a slightly higher percentage of gay men are into musical theatre than straight men - [citation needed]) does not equal a generalisation (everyone into musical theatre is gay; all gay men are into musical theatre).

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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQ Thread - Queer Support!

Postby Delalyra » Tue Jun 02, 2009 3:22 am UTC

And really, these stereotypes? Make absolutely no sense whatsoever when you think about them for even a minute.

Otoh, my life experiences are different from others', I can think of a number of straight guys who did musical theatre with me in high school. And I know a few gay men online who do not fit that particular, or any other, stereotype at all.

Regardless!
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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQ Thread - Queer Support!

Postby abitha » Tue Jun 02, 2009 5:11 pm UTC

The 'gaydar' thing is interesting... I find that I often can tell whether a guy is gay or straight without being told, I certainly can't claim 100% accuracy though (I'm a straight female, for clarity). I usually can't tell at all whether a girl is lesbian or not (unless I like see her kissing another girl or something!) Most of the time I'm not really that interested in whether someone's gay or straight, so I don't particularly go round trying to second-guess everyone.

A couple of times recently it's been sort of the opposite situation - as in, people are gossiping about a guy and all think he's gay because he fits some of the stereotypes (why the hell do they care anyway? stop gossiping, you gossipy people) and I'll be certain that he's not - not because I have any particular evidence, but I just don't get that 'vibe' off him. I'm friends with quite a few gay guys (some who are out to lots of people, some who aren't, some who fit a lot of the stereotypes and others who don't fit any) and I think there might be some subtle signals that people give off without meaning to, but they're not amazingly reliable.

Thinking about it, my impression is probably mostly formed from how a guy responds if I flirt with him a bit. Hard to put a finger on exactly what, but I think there is a difference in how a gay guy responds to a girl flirting with him and how a straight-guy-but-not-interested-in-that-particular-girl responds. Also, I have something of a history of the guys I'm attracted to turning out to be gay (not all of them, but a significant proportion), so this in itself is also something of an indicator for me!

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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQ Thread - Queer Support!

Postby eternauta3k » Tue Jun 02, 2009 9:59 pm UTC

steewi wrote:If someone makes a "wow, that really made you look gay" comment about something I've just done, I don't necessarily deny it, but just move on.
I think "Yes it is" (thus rejecting that there's anything wrong with that) and "No it isn't" (saying it's a silly generalization) are both good responses.
A problem in this area is not knowing how far to take it (avoiding tipping off people). I'm almost completely straight, but quite paranoid. That means I'm controlling my reactions and I never know the "proper" amount of attention to pay to scantily clad girls in TV or elsewhere. If I weren't consciously thinking about this, it'd come naturally, but I can't help it. I guess the solution is to stop worrying, specially around my friends, whom I should be able to talk to about this.
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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQ Thread - Queer Support!

Postby crickets » Tue Jun 02, 2009 11:54 pm UTC

eternauta3k wrote:
steewi wrote:If someone makes a "wow, that really made you look gay" comment about something I've just done, I don't necessarily deny it, but just move on.
I think "Yes it is" (thus rejecting that there's anything wrong with that) and "No it isn't" (saying it's a silly generalization) are both good responses.


My favourite was always something along the lines of "Your point being?" or "And that matters why now?"

Then again, my mom used to ask me if i was a lesbian alllll the time.
To which i responded "Does it matter?"

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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQ Thread - Queer Support!

Postby podbaydoor » Wed Jun 03, 2009 12:07 am UTC

http://www.whitehouse.gov/the_press_off ... ide-Month/

June is officially LGBT Pride Month! (In America, I mean.)
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Re: [SAFESPACE] LGBTIQQ Thread - Queer Support!

Postby Jessica » Wed Jun 03, 2009 5:03 am UTC

That's pretty cool, right there.
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